06 Mar 17
Originally posted by PudgenikNo, we are not going there. Here is what you said what I was replying to:
And what would be your justice?
Originally posted by Pudgenik
...in no way do i wish harm on their church through these scandals. We are the created Children of God after all.
I'm asking you what you mean by "harm" in this scenario?I'm asking you if you have read up on the material?
Justice would be the perpetrators being exposed and incarcerated, furthermore the tightening of the legal requirements for the reporting of these allegations should be brought in. Whether or not the "scandal" "harms" this religious organisation is really not my concern but I am interested in why it is what you are concerned about.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by galveston75My deepest sympathy on your loss; I lost my father 6 years ago and no matter how expected, the loss is severe. Based on your other comments I respectfully suggest you not visit this forum for a while and especially not read this thread, which after all is just a debate.
I have to add to this even though I feel I shouldn't be reading your post because of the darkness you bring here. My mother died a week ago today and feel a loss I can't explain so I'm in a very down mood right now and your basically making me sick reading this stuff you post..
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by divegeesterNo you are right that i have not read up on the findings of the Royal Australian Commission's report.
I am not saying you are defending the guilty, I'm asking you if you have read the link in the OP and if you have read up on the material in the other thread I also linked to - clearly you haven't.
This is not about the Catholic Church this is about the Jehovah's Witness church. What ah have happened in the Catholic Church has no bearing on the findin ...[text shortened]... he Jehovah's Witness church didn't know about the child sex abuse, then you really ought to say.
Just making comments based on my own experience as a Catholic.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by PudgenikIf there were Catholics posting in the forum on the same unpleasant topic relating to their church, and doing so in the same manner as the JWs here do, i.e. to defend the organisation rather than acknowledge the flaws, then I'm certain those Catholic posters would get the same response..
No you are right that i have not read up on the findings of the Royal Australian Commission's report.
Just making comments based on my own experience as a Catholic.
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by divegeesterThanks for the advice but not here....
If there were Catholics posting in the forum on the same unpleasant topic relating to their church, and doing so in the same manner as the JWs here do, i.e. to defend the organisation rather than acknowledge the flaws, then I'm certain those Catholic posters would get the same response..
" i.e. to defend the organisation rather than acknowledge the flaws,"
So if you were accused of lets say, breaking most driving laws every time you get behind the wheel of your car ( not at all implying you do ) and in reality yes you have received a couple citations, but yet some say " you have broken many driving laws, in fact thousands of times".
How would you react? Yes you would no doubt admit you have done this a few times but not thousands because you know the truth.
Get my point? I don't believe any JW here has denied that this has not happened. I certainly haven't as well as the other JW's here. Of course it has happened because every JW is a human and as imperfect as you are.
If you would "actually read the link" I posted it mentions that many of these abuses were from a family member. Does it specifically say that these guilty family members were also JW's? Don't assume they were.
06 Mar 17
2 edits
Originally posted by galveston75Are you happy to discuss this topic then Galveston75, or are you going to continue to fling ad-hominems at me, accuse me of making you feel sick, threaten me with your god's observations of me and castigate me for the "darkness" I bring to this forum, while you plead the "family bereavement 5th"?
Thanks for the advice but not here....
" i.e. to defend the organisation rather than acknowledge the flaws,"
So if you were accused of lets say, breaking most driving laws every time you get behind the wheel of your car ( not at all implying you do ) and in reality yes you have received a couple citations, but yet some say " you have broken many dr ...[text shortened]... oes it specifically say that these guilty family members were also JW's? Don't assume they were.
Just let me know one way or the other...
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by divegeesterI appreciated your first comment about my mother. Now leave my mothers death out of it....
Are you happy to discuss this topic then Galveston75, or are you going to continue to fling ad-hominems at me, accuse me of making you feel sick, threaten me with your god's observations of me and castigate me for the "darkness" I bring to this forum, while you plead the "family bereavement 5th"?
Just let me know one way or the other...
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by FMFNo the report said thousands were reported..... "a culture that meant of more than 1000 reports of child sex abuse over 60 years, not one was referred to police".
The Royal Commission found that [b]NO cases of child sex abuse were reported to the authorities by the JW organization in sixty years in Australia. That is zero. You say "thousands" were reported? The commission found the number to be nought. None. Zero.[/b]
Also.... Deuteronomy 19:15
15 “No single witness may convict another "for any error or any sin" that he may commit. On the testimony of two witnesses or on the testimony of three witnesses the matter should be established."
This was a law from God. We are no longer under those laws as Jesus fulfilled the laws. But the principles are still there from many of those laws and the wisdom from Jehovah still applies. One must remember the many things available to us today with science did not exist then that have only become available in the last few years.
If there were no obvious proofs of a sin committed against someone, the proof needed to make a judgement against one persons words had to verified ( same rules as today but with modern help available ) somehow and this is where the two or more witnesses of that offence came into play.
If no other eye witnesses or proof were available and the person was truly abused, that was a sad and horrible thing to happen indeed. But one has to remember that Jehovah see's all and is the one the bible says we have to wait on for his vengeance to take place on all who have done things such as this to other humans all thru history.
If anyone here were accused of abusing a child but you were truly innocent, would you not want to have all the proof you could find that you were innocent? Not only does God's rule on this help the abused without question, it helps the innocent.
06 Mar 17
4 edits
Originally posted by galveston75Whilst I do sincerely sympathise with your loss, I will remind you that it was you who brought the topic into this conversation Galvaston75, not me.
I appreciated your first comment about my mother. Now leave my mothers death out of it....
I do feel that you using a personal tradgey such as this in a forum in this manner, and then berating one of your detractors about it, is not good forum etiquette and I refuse to feel guilty for posting in this thread as it is entirely your choice whether or not you engage.
You've got previous for this sort of forum behaviour, as is well documented.
06 Mar 17
1 edit
Originally posted by galveston75As he is watching...do you think Jehovah was pleased when he saw the Watchtower leadership raise a two year legal challenge to prevent a bonafide official investigation into the accusations engulfing the JW religious organisation?
Jehovah is watching every move you make........
06 Mar 17
Originally posted by divegeesterAnd you know what they did that? You seem to know all the facts so please explain......
As he is watching...do you think Jehovah was pleased when he saw the Watchtower leadership raise a two year legal challenge to prevent a bonafide official investigation into the accusations engulfing the JW religious organisation?