Out of Body Experience?

Originally posted by karoly aczel
Of course a ludic dream is not an out of body experience.

So what is it then, a regular , 'in body' experience.? What is that anyway? Is there an opposite to an OBE , maybe a 'non-OBE'? 🙄

In my opinion it's a regular experience associated to our bodymind, as regular as any other experience we perceive thanks to our 6 senses
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Originally posted by black beetle
In my opinion it's a regular experience associated to our bodymind, as regular as any other experience we perceive thanks to our 6 senses
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So in your definition does bodymind end where the physical body does?

Originally posted by Dasa
arful "No thanks" and almost immediately awoke in hospital.

This is absolutely 100% true.

And that doesn't scare you that you will probably go back there? And if you do you won't be coming back as someone else.

Originally posted by karoly aczel
So in your definition does bodymind end where the physical body does?

Bodymind is ideally a nirmanakaya aggregation (an aggregation that takes place in the conventional material world we experience herenow). When the physical body dies, this aggregation can dissolve into another, mind-only level of existence -into sambhogakaya, into the uncollapsed wavefunction stored properties. Hopefully these sambhogakaya aggregations could disolve into the perfected nature (dharmakaya), into the sphere of the fundamental empty wavefunction;

However thus I have heard that is common: from (the bardo/ stage of) death the aggregation of the bodymind is usually diminished into ignorance (ignorance is the empty nature of the reality we perceive herenow thanks to our bodymind). From there, the karmic patterns of predispotition for embodyment are activated and turned into consciousness. Consiousness is turned into name and form, then into sense organs and faculties, then into contact, then into feeling, then into craving, then into grasping and appropriation, then into becoming, then into birth and, then, finally, into death again. This is the Wheel of Life
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Yikes, at the second phrase of the second paragraph of my above post I had to write "predisposition of embodiment" -excuse me for the inconvenience
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Originally posted by utherpendragon
I have often heard the medical community say that, but it does not explain why so many have the same type of "hullicination"in these instances. It is a bogus theory IMO and as I have posted here before I have experienced this phenomenon personally.

“....I have often heard the medical community say that, but it does not explain why so many have the same type of "hullicination"in these instances. ...”s

actually it does! We all have certain similarities in our brains and therefore it is not surprising that we have similarities in our brain responses to oxygen deficiency. That's why so many have the same type of hallucination! I saw a documentary some years ago that showed that science has already discovered the cause of these outer-body experiences -at least those that are caused specifically by oxygen deficiency. I cannot remember the details but I remember it explained all the main features of outer-body experiences! It also went on to fully explain the “tunnel of light” experiences so many people have when having near-death experiences.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Really. Is this why they often share the same elements?

See my post to utherpendragon

Originally posted by Andrew Hamilton
“....I have often heard the medical community say that, but it does not explain why so many have the same type of "hullicination"in these instances. ...”s

actually it does! We all have certain similarities in our brains and therefore it is not surprising that we have similarities in our brain responses to oxygen deficiency. That's why so many hav ...[text shortened]... ain the “tunnel of light” experiences so many people have when having near-death experiences.

yes. I know. I think I have seen this same documentary. It does not explain to me the seeing and conversing with departed loved ones on the other side which is another common element.
As well as the viewing of the room from above and recalling accurately what happened (the moment their hearts stopped) with the other people in the room. Who was there,their conversations,etc.

Originally posted by twhitehead
But if you did remember the pictures it would be conclusive proof of an out of body experience.

Maybe a lucky guess if done once, but multiple times it will mean it is more likely to be an OBE.

As for the quote by Dr Sam Parnia in the article:

"And if no one sees the pictures, it shows these experiences are illusions or false memories."

I will say this is wrong (maybe the BBC misquoted him). If no one sees the pictures (which is much more likely than them seeing them), it will reinforce our conclusion that it is illusions or false memories, but wouldn't definitely show it.

Originally posted by RBHILL
And that doesn't scare you that you will probably go back there? And if you do you won't be coming back as someone else.

i REALLY DONT KNOW HOW YOU INTERPRETTED dASA'S story to ellicit such a response.
Why would it scare him or anyone else to go back there?
The only fear is the fear that you carry around with you. God is love and is everywhere, so fear is only an illusion.
OBE's helped me learn about fear, ie. the illusory nature of fear.

All very interesting. I do know of disassociative effects psychologically, which is more vague than the reports of "out of body" experiences, more like a vague sense of being not a part of the body.
The card experiment is interesting. Look forward to the outcome of that.

There have already been numerous veridical accounts (that is verified reports from seemingly unconscious people of things, events that would have been unknowable either from their observed unconscious state or from their locality.

Some are recounted in detail towards the end of this long page and verified by others present:
http://www.near-death.com/experiences/research11.html

These reports are not strictly scientific in that many are unrepeatable by their very nature. This does not mean they didn''t occur however, just that they cannot be verified completely in current scientific practice.

Some of these accounts impress me. I think there are probably a variety of "causes" of these phenomenon and attributing them all to one "reason" may well be wrong. The accounts that impress me most are those who make verified reports who are people normally skeptical of such things, and skilled in observation and interpretation, such as doctors.

I do not necessarily accept the interpretative attachments of the nature of these events, such as "souls". I would tend to think of a temporary locus of awareness that has become less strongly "linked" to a still living body. And I am of the mind to understand the Ground of the manifestation of everything "normal" or "unusual" as Awareness itself. This concept embraces to me much that underlies strange phenomena in quantum science and in many paranormal phenomena.

I do also think that some phenomena may well be sourced from memories or dreamlike constructions of the mind. Encountering "deceased relatives" may be of this order. There are seemingly strange incongruences in some of these reports.
One I was told of was the deceased relative was smoking a pipe! Mmmm?

A mixed picture overall, but I do think there are verified events of out of body awareness. And by the looks of it there are not many here that have had such events, however you interpret them.

Originally posted by utherpendragon
yes. I know. I think I have seen this same documentary. It does not explain to me the seeing and conversing with departed loved ones on the other side which is another common element.
As well as the viewing of the room from above and recalling accurately what happened (the moment their hearts stopped) with the other people in the room. Who was there,their conversations,etc.

“....It does not explain to me the seeing and conversing with departed loved ones on the other side which is another common element. ...”

I am strangely unaware of this “ common element” -I think I would have heard of it.
Have you got any evidence (web-links) that this is a “common element”?

“...As well as the viewing of the room from above and recalling accurately what happened (the moment their hearts stopped) with the other people in the room. Who was there,their conversations,etc. ...”

actually, that was explained. The brain gets clues from the senses and the brain subconsciously does a very good job of deducing/guessing what the world would look like from above and generates the corresponding hallucination.

Originally posted by Andrew Hamilton
“....It does not explain to me the seeing and conversing with departed loved ones on the other side which is another common element. ...”

I am strangely unaware of this “ common element” -I think I would have heard of it.
Have you got any evidence (web-links) that this is a “common element”?

“...As well as the viewing of the room from above ...[text shortened]... uessing what the world would look like from above and generates the corresponding hallucination.

The following is a good site to check out.

http://nhneneardeath.ning.com/

Originally posted by Taoman
I was wondering if any have had an "out of body" expereince and would like to share it? I haven't.

Yes I had and they are pretty amazing.
It might be a trick of our mind, although I do not understand why our minds would and could have developed such tricks.
The same for near dead experiences. As far I understand the evolution theory learns that mutations which are good for survival stay through growing procreation and changes that are not helpful usually disappear because procreation slows down by lack of survivors. If that is correct i wonder why we have developed in our minds this way How does it contribute the growth of our survival chances? How can out of body and near death experiences contribute to a better survival?

Originally posted by souverein
Yes I had and they are pretty amazing.
It might be a trick of our mind, although I do not understand why our minds would and could have developed such tricks.
The same for near dead experiences. As far I understand the evolution theory learns that mutations which are good for survival stay through growing procreation and changes that are not helpful u ...[text shortened]... rvival chances? How can out of body and near death experiences contribute to a better survival?

It is unlikely that near death experiences contribute to a better survival, but just a by product of other things that contribute to a better survival. The brain is starved of oxygen, and in the processes of shutting down non-essential bodily functions (in the "hope" that recovery is imminent), causes neuron activity which, as a side effect, give those experiences familiar to people who have nearly died.