1. Joined
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    26 Jul '07 17:50
    I was wondering what people thought of his message. I am really currious what Christians and non Christians thing, so please specify that if you wouldnt mind

    Here are 3 links to youtube videos. He talks about how a Christian can know they are a Christian thus knkow they are saved.

    4 minutes of your time
    YouTube

    10 minutes of your time (audio mix of the 60 min sermon)
    YouTube

    Bonus full 60 minute sermon
    YouTube
  2. Standard memberRemoved
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    26 Jul '07 22:32
    Excellent...He is absolutely correct. If I may add....I know I am a Christian because I can speak in tongues, speak in tongues with interpretation, and prophecy. These are what I call the worship manefestations. I have also experienced word of knowledge and word of wisdom. Every believer has the potential to operate all 9 manefestations. The first three as I mentioned above are at the believers discretion. Having said that, they are to be done only with a group of likeminded believers with the end to edify, exhort and comfort. The other 6 are operated at God's discretion. Some believe these are individual gifts. But that is erroneous teaching. The gift is the gift of holy spirit.
    Like a swiss army knife which has several functions, so is the gift of holy spirit. It has 9 functions or manefestations to help the individual believer.
  3. Standard memberNemesio
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    26 Jul '07 22:36
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    Excellent...He is absolutely correct. If I may add....I know I am a Christian because I can speak in tongues, speak in tongues with interpretation, and prophecy. These are what I call the worship manefestations. I have also experienced word of knowledge and word of wisdom. Every believer has the potential to operate all 9 manefestations. The first three ...[text shortened]... the gift of holy spirit. It has 9 functions or manefestations to help the individual believer.
    The verb is prophesy (pronounced prof-uh-sai). The thing which you
    testify is a prophecy (pronounced prof-uh-see).

    What sort of prophesying have you done? Weird vague ones like in
    Daniel (a tower of iron will crumble when the Sun cries at the sound of
    the moon's sleeping) or like real concrete ones?

    There was some discussion some months back between two individuals,
    though I cannot remember who, one who was asserting that the time
    for these manifestations has past.

    Nemesio
  4. Standard memberRemoved
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    26 Jul '07 23:121 edit
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    The verb is prophesy (pronounced prof-uh-sai). The thing which you
    testify is a prophecy (pronounced prof-uh-see).

    What sort of prophesying have you done? Weird vague ones like in
    Daniel (a tower of iron will crumble when the Sun cries at the sound of
    the moon's sleeping) or like real concrete ones?

    There was some discussion some months back bet ...[text shortened]... emember who, one who was asserting that the time
    for these manifestations has past.

    Nemesio
    Prophesy is is foretelling or forthtelling. I do the latter.
    Sorry about the spelling.....
  5. Standard memberRemoved
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    26 Jul '07 23:131 edit
    Originally posted by ryunix
    I was wondering what people thought of his message. I am really currious what Christians and non Christians thing, so please specify that if you wouldnt mind

    Here are 3 links to youtube videos. He talks about how a Christian can know they are a Christian thus knkow they are saved.

    4 minutes of your time
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OY6F0pkArds

    1 ...[text shortened]... watch?v=d3XA2k8S8Tk

    Bonus full 60 minute sermon
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uuabITeO4l8
    After thinking about this I realize I responded too quickly. I tend to disagree with him. I'll explain why in a bit...
  6. Hmmm . . .
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    26 Jul '07 23:471 edit
    The (modern, at least) Christian understanding of prophecy, and the Jewish understanding of prophecy seem to be entirely distinct. The Jewish prophets were those who spoke the truth of YHVH to their contemporaries, concerning the present situation. Any “foretelling” or future-telling was, at most, secondary (and not always accurate).

    Without going to looks it up—and therefore subject to my memory—there was, I believe, a king whose death Jeremiah prophesied, who did not die in that way... (I’ll let somebody else look it up.)

    EDIT: In the argument between those who speak in tongues, and those who reject that, I have generally come down on the side of the former--for various reasons.
  7. Standard memberNemesio
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    27 Jul '07 00:37
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    Prophesy is is foretelling or forthtelling. I do the latter.
    Sorry about the spelling.....
    What's 'forthtelling?'

    Nemesio
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    27 Jul '07 00:39
    The manefestation of prophesy that is mentioned in 1Corith. 14 is the forthtelling. It is not like the prophesy of the old Testament. It is not "revelation" it is "inspiration". It is always edification, exhortation, and/or comfort. In a believers meeting, it is done by those who have been in prayer throughout the week, studying, etc. In other words, those who choose to manefest are excited, at peace with God, walking the walk, etc. There are times when I don't choose to manefest, and I let others do it. We are instructed to have 2-3 or even 4 believers manefest if they so choose. Sometimes no one does, so we just have prayer before the teaching. The words that come out are always praising God or exhorting or comforting the body of believers present.
    I have been to churches where people are speaking in tongues with no interpretation. This is abusing the gift of holy spirit because no one is edified. Like any thing in the church, it is to be done decently and in order....
  9. Standard memberNemesio
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    27 Jul '07 00:42
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    The manefestation of prophesy that is mentioned in 1Corith. 14 is the forthtelling. It is not like the prophesy of the old Testament. It is not "revelation" it is "inspiration". It is always edification, exhortation, and/or comfort. In a believers meeting, it is done by those who have been in prayer throughout the week, studying, etc. In other words, tho ...[text shortened]... no one is edified. Like any thing in the church, it is to be done decently and in order....
    I'm still not following. Can you give an example of how 'forthtelling'
    might look to an observer?

    Nemesio
  10. Standard memberNemesio
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    27 Jul '07 00:43
    Originally posted by vistesd
    The (modern, at least) Christian understanding of prophecy, and the Jewish understanding of prophecy seem to be entirely distinct. The Jewish prophets were those who spoke the truth of YHVH to their contemporaries, concerning the present situation. Any “foretelling” or future-telling was, at most, secondary (and not always accurate).

    Without goi ...[text shortened]... hose who reject that, I have generally come down on the side of the former--for various reasons.
    If you have time, could you expound upon the Jewish understanding of
    prophecy?

    Nemesio
  11. Hmmm . . .
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    27 Jul '07 00:50
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    The manefestation of prophesy that is mentioned in 1Corith. 14 is the forthtelling. It is not like the prophesy of the old Testament. It is not "revelation" it is "inspiration". It is always edification, exhortation, and/or comfort. In a believers meeting, it is done by those who have been in prayer throughout the week, studying, etc. In other words, tho ...[text shortened]... no one is edified. Like any thing in the church, it is to be done decently and in order....
    That’s a fair explanation.

    Why do you think—if you think—that this does not happen outside Christianity? You know that one of my favorite NT verses is:

    The spirit where it wishes blows.
    The sound of it you hear, but do not know
    whence it comes nor where it goes.
    For those born of the spirit, it is so.

    I do not hold to it just because it is written in the Bible, but because it speaks the truth.
  12. Standard memberRemoved
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    27 Jul '07 00:53
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    I'm still not following. Can you give an example of how 'forthtelling'
    might look to an observer?

    Nemesio
    An example might look like this....
    "Know for a truth and a certainty that the Lord your God has loved you from the foundations of the world. He has called you to a mighty calling. Be bold and shine as lights in this world, Fear not, for He walks with you all the days of your lives."

    I have heard very similiar prophetic messages.
  13. Standard memberNemesio
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    27 Jul '07 01:00
    Originally posted by checkbaiter
    An example might look like this....
    "Know for a truth and a certainty that the Lord your God has loved you from the foundations of the world. He has called you to a mighty calling. Be bold and shine as lights in this world, Fear not, for He walks with you all the days of your lives."

    I have heard very similiar prophetic messages.
    So, it's the proclaiming or the channeling of Divine Truths through the
    vessel of the individual, then?

    Nemesio
  14. Standard memberRemoved
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    27 Jul '07 01:00
    Originally posted by vistesd
    That’s a fair explanation.

    Why do you think—if you think—that this does not happen outside Christianity? You know that one of my favorite NT verses is:

    The spirit where it wishes blows.
    The sound of it you hear, but do not know
    whence it comes nor where it goes.
    For those born of the spirit, it is so.

    I do not hold to it just because it is written in the Bible, but because it speaks the truth.
    Because it is a manefestaion of the gift of holy spirit. I do know that even Balaam could not curse God's people....so I don't claim to be an expert in this field....
  15. Standard memberRemoved
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    27 Jul '07 01:011 edit
    Originally posted by Nemesio
    So, it's the proclaiming or the channeling of Divine Truths through the
    vessel of the individual, then?

    Nemesio
    I suppose...you could put it that way...but it is still "inspiration" not direct revelation.
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