Saved but damned

Originally posted by @tom-wolsey
So I amicably concede that your perspective is correct, using your definition of a word that has multiple definitions... and you turn it around and accuse me of dishonesty.

Are you capable of being a decent human being?

I am a decent human being. Maybe we also differ in what is the correct definition of a decent human being. One of the overriding qualities of a decent human being is the ability to speak the truth regardless of the consequences. I can also quote the bible where God hates liars, lying and deceit.

There is one standard definition of a Christian given by man.
There is one definition given by Paul - members of the eclesias. ie all those baptised into Christ.

Where did you get your definition from?

Originally posted by @rajk999
Where did you get your definition from?

Playing that game are we. I've already gone to great length in answering that question. As per usual, you don't listen to what I'm saying. You talk over me. It's like you're chomping at the bit, lying in wait, ready to pounce on anyone that dares reply to you directly... with your judgments and condemnations already thought out--and no concern whatsoever about anything they have to say.

Originally posted by @ghost-of-a-duke
Imagine a town where everyone (as a result of loose living) had acquired massive debt on their credit cards, debt that they were unable to repay on their own. Then one day a mysterious chap arrives in town and inexplicably transfers the debt of every resident on to his own credit card. All their debts had become his own and every person in the town ...[text shortened]... o their old ways and acquire new debt that this time would result in their ultimate destruction.

Bad analogy.

Jesus paid the whole debt, past, present and future. Even all the debt of everyone not yet born.

The rub of it is though, is that the debtor must believe that Jesus paid the debt, otherwise the debt remains in the unbelievers account.

Originally posted by @rajk999
I am a decent human being. Maybe we also differ in what is the correct definition of a decent human being. One of the overriding qualities of a decent human being is the ability to speak the truth regardless of the consequences. I can also quote the bible where God hates liars, lying and deceit.

There is one standard definition of a Christian given by m ...[text shortened]... s of the eclesias. ie all those baptised into Christ.

Where did you get your definition from?

" I can also quote the bible where God hates liars,.."

No you can't.

Originally posted by @rajk999
What you are doing is called the no true Scotsman fallacy.. It is a deceptive way to change definitions mid-argument so that your conclusions conform to the new definition.

Google says [i]No true Scotsman or appeal to purity is an informal fallacy in which one attempts to protect a universal generalization from counterexamples by changing the definition ...[text shortened]... ans anyhow you like and that is your prerogative but that excludes you from national discussion.

ROFL, you actually said this...OH my...Mister I'm a servant of Jesus only so long as you get
to change the things Jesus said to suit your meaning not scripture. Do you even have a
mirror in your home?

Originally posted by @secondson
Bad analogy.

Jesus paid the whole debt, past, present and future. Even all the debt of everyone not yet born.

The rub of it is though, is that the debtor must believe that Jesus paid the debt, otherwise the debt remains in the unbelievers account.

The debtor MUST believe?

I tend to think that God would not put that 'clause' on one's eternal home. The crucifixion was too big a deal for such a burden on the human mind.

Besides, Rajk999 has stated that belief is not necessary. 🙂

Originally posted by @secondson
Bad analogy.

Jesus paid the whole debt, past, present and future. Even all the debt of everyone not yet born.

The rub of it is though, is that the debtor must believe that Jesus paid the debt, otherwise the debt remains in the unbelievers account.

I would be interested in seeing a reference from JESUS CHRIST where there is some requirement to believe that Jesus paid the debt.

Originally posted by @chaney3
The debtor MUST believe?

I tend to think that God would not put that 'clause' on one's eternal home. The crucifixion was too big a deal for such a burden on the human mind.

Besides, Rajk999 has stated that belief is not necessary. 🙂

Yes chaney, believe.

The Word believe occurs in 114 verses of the New Testament in the KJV.

Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

That simple.

Originally posted by @rajk999
I would be interested in seeing a reference from JESUS CHRIST where there is some requirement to believe that Jesus paid the debt.

Sure, and I'd like to see a reference from Jesus saying pigs don't fly.

Originally posted by @secondson
Yes chaney, believe.

The Word [b]believe occurs in 114 verses of the New Testament in the KJV.

Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

That simple.[/b]

Paul said that. Why would Jesus Christ omit such a requirement if it was as critical as you think?

Originally posted by @secondson
Sure, and I'd like to see a reference from Jesus saying pigs don't fly.

Ok so nothing from Christ. Therefore all those people to whom Jesus preached are doomed. Is that it ? Followers of Jesus Christ are doomed ? lol 😀

Originally posted by @secondson
Yes chaney, believe.

The Word [b]believe occurs in 114 verses of the New Testament in the KJV.

Romans 10:9
That if thou shalt confess with thy mouth the Lord Jesus, and shalt believe in thine heart that God hath raised him from the dead, thou shalt be saved.

That simple.[/b]

I do believe.

But I find it hard to imagine that God would demand such a thing. It happened 2,000 years ago, and God didn't create our brains to process that.

Originally posted by @rajk999
I would be interested in seeing a reference from JESUS CHRIST where there is some requirement to believe that Jesus paid the debt.

You want an exact English translation that has Jesus saying the words that Jesus paid
the debt? You don't provide exact translations for things I have asked from you, like
where does it say Atheist will be accepted by God, or saved specifically? I can show you
where Jesus does say those that deny Him, He will deny, but you believe they get past
that by doing some good works, even though how many that will take, what kind are they
and so on, are also not referenced in scripture by not only Jesus but every writer.

I can show you a Jesus quote that says everyone who does not believe in Jesus is
condemn already, that too would cause Atheist to all be cast out of God's Kingdom.

Originally posted by @rajk999
Paul said that. Why would Jesus Christ omit such a requirement if it was as critical as you think?

Your name is Nabal.

Originally posted by @secondson
Your name is Nabal.

Cannot answer that question .. I got it.