Separation of church and state in US? Not now

Originally posted by @divegeester
Can one of you Americans please provide a preci of what’s happened?

I'm guessing that what you mean is précis, or a concise summary.

There seems to be language included in the Senate's recently passed tax bill that seems to allow for churches to donate to the campaigns of politicians. This has never been allowed before, due to the clause in the First Amendment which says that "Congress shall make no law respecting an establishment of religion", which traditionally has been taken to mean that Congress cannot favor one religion over another, thus establishing a "state religion". This has traditionally been regarded as "the separation of church and state". Clearly, allowing churches to donate directly to political campaigns opens the door to congressional favoritism, or even a "quid pro quo" deal between them. This would violate the First Amendment.

Originally posted by @divegeester
Yes it is inadequate, as on the surface it just reads like another sonhousiastic rant against religion. I just wondering what tax law it is that been made that he is on about. I could spend a hour googling it but I’m not going to especially if sonhouse can’t provide factual content and at least a link.

“. I just wondering what tax law it is that been made that he is on about.”

He is “on about” a clause in the tax bill that newly allows religions to collect money and support candidates with it.

This is stated in the OP.

Originally posted by @js357
“. I just wondering what tax law it is that been made that he is on about.”

He is “on about” a clause in the tax bill that newly allows religions to collect money and support candidates with it.

This is stated in the OP.

http://thehill.com/policy/finance/358447-gop-tax-bill-would-allow-churches-to-endorse-political-candidates

It's not bullshyte, it is real. Trumpf VOWED to destroy the law preventing churches supportimg candidates before he ever took office.

I wonder how much support he will have when the middle class realizes they just got a screw job where higher taxes are inevitable to support the 15% loss of revenue from corporations and the increase in the national debt that will follow. He must think we are really stupid if we are supposed to think a 15% gift is going to cause corporations to spend more on US plants or rebuilt the steel industry or some such, rather than what WILL happen, their coffers just grow larger so the CEO's can now have a platinum parachute, to add to the 3 golden parachutes they have now.

Originally posted by @js357
“. I just wondering what tax law it is that been made that he is on about.”

He is “on about” a clause in the tax bill that newly allows religions to collect money and support candidates with it.

This is stated in the OP.

I know what he’s on about I was asking for a factual reference, as you well know. 🙂

Originally posted by @divegeester
I know what he’s on about I was asking for a factual reference, as you well know. 🙂

You didn't see my last post where I put up a link?

Trumpf vowed to destroy the law not allowing churches to support political candidates. So now he has.

What is weird is there is little in the news about this digusting development, like it is not worth pursuing.

I think it should be rung up the highest pole and rung out to all the land showing how the Iranization of the US has begun.

If you think that is BS, you don't know the agenda of republicans.

Originally posted by @js357
The slippery slope that has demonstrably been pushed is described in the OP. Understand, the US GOP congress has no interest in deposing organized religion, nor vice versa, as long as religion delivers the votes and congress delivers the “religious liberty.”

Who gets to define religious liberty, a god hater who proclaims he doesn’t even believe in one?

Originally posted by @kellyjay
Who gets to define religious liberty, a god hater who proclaims he doesn’t even believe in one?

No of course the god lovers should be the only ones allowed to define the limits of religious liberty. In fact the god lovers should be the only ones allowed to define who is a god lover. That makes perfect sense. How can it be any other way? How can we let the god haters decide anything?

Say, how do I know you are a genuine god lover?

Originally posted by @divegeester
I know what he’s on about I was asking for a factual reference, as you well know. 🙂

“...as you well know?”

Are you accusing me of something you won’t state?

Factual references seem to be under attack as fake news nowadays whenever they challenge the Trump/GOP agenda. So “as you know” we are each of us obligated to (or is it free to) establish our own stable of factual references. There is no point to require “factual references” of someone unless they qualify as factual references for you. So just fact check on your own, using terms like tax bill religious freedom. You will soon find terms like Johnson Amendment. We are all our own fact checkers now. As you well know.🙂

Originally posted by @kellyjay
Who gets to define religious liberty, a god hater who proclaims he doesn’t even believe in one?

It is an accepted situation where the USA does not want a theocracy. Thus separation of church and state,

These cynical new laws puts the church in direct line of political ascension. It would be the death of scientific freedom if the US went to a theocracy.

You have to know that as a fact, just look at Europe a thousand years ago, you don't mouth the company line, Earth is the center of the universe, there is a big bowl overhead that has little lights on it that are stars and when comets come, it is the sign of the devil and be fearul.

You really want to go back to that? And do you think it impossible here in the US in century 21 considering the rising political power of the extreme right wing Christian players now?

Already several states are forcing creationism to be taught as if it were a science and even you have to know full well it is definitely not a science but a belief but to be taught to young minds that it is a science is travesty, a huge twisting of the educational system.

You show me a 200 million year old parakeet fossil, everything about evolution goes out the window but we DON"T find such things, we FIND a progression of life forms with similar traits in a line going back hundreds of millions of years and you can bitch about the assumptions of dating all you want but scientists are confident if a date says 100 million years old, ALWAYS followed by plus or minus X amount of years it is because of hundreds of years of advancements in basic chemistry, knowledge of radioactive materials and such and results verified through several separat measurments all leading to the same answer, they can be confident they know something is 100 million years old plus or minus 200,000 years or some such. They NEVER say, this fossil is 123.49900 million years old, they actually know the limitations which is what took those hundreds of years of research to FIND such limits of accuracy.

Originally posted by @sonhouse
You didn't see my last post where I put up a link?

Trumpf vowed to destroy the law not allowing churches to support political candidates. So now he has.

What is weird is there is little in the news about this digusting development, like it is not worth pursuing.

I think it should be rung up the highest pole and rung out to all the land showing h ...[text shortened]... ation of the US has begun.

If you think that is BS, you don't know the agenda of republicans.

I wouldn't exactly call it the "Iranization of the US", though.

How about "American Theocracy"?

Originally posted by @sonhouse
It is an accepted situation where the USA does not want a theocracy. Thus separation of church and state,

These cynical new laws puts the church in direct line of political ascension. It would be the death of scientific freedom if the US went to a theocracy.

You have to know that as a fact, just look at Europe a thousand years ago, you don't mouth t ...[text shortened]... itations which is what took those hundreds of years of research to FIND such limits of accuracy.

A theocracy, the world is going to come to an end, why someone wants to teach our kids
that Creation is something many people believe is true. This upsets you, not that they are
now teaching kids they cannot tell a boy from a girl, but where the time line starts and
how. The beginning of all things actually has a cause could be taught, verses no one
knows, this upsets you, not that they teach kids it is okay to be sexually active, and from
there girls get pregnant, and from there another thing parents are no longer allowed to
know, their child can surgery to have her kid killed off without their knowledge or consent.

Someone might teach their kids God views them as important, and loves them, this
upsets you as they acknowledge God, not that they now teach men can claim they feel
like they are woman, so they can go into woman's bathrooms with cell phone cameras.
You are a piece of work on what gets you going, but hey this is the world you are pushing
upon kids against parents wishes. I guess you believe it is a good thing people are
attempting to clean religion from the public area, sanitizing attempting to get it out of
sight! The religious can worship in churches as long as they only talk about those things
you approve of, because even within churches you have a list of does and don'ts people
can talk about.

Million year old fossils, oh boy, America is heading towards a theocracy because not all
believe that is true.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
A theocracy, the world is going to come to an end, why someone wants to teach our kids
that Creation is something many people believe is true. This upsets you, not that they are
now teaching kids they cannot tell a boy from a girl, but where the time line starts and
how. The beginning of all things actually has a cause could be taught, verses no one
kn ...[text shortened]... d fossils, oh boy, America is heading towards a theocracy because not all
believe that is true.

Are you suddenly going to stop talking to sonhouse because you disagree with him?

Originally posted by @kellyjay
A theocracy, the world is going to come to an end, why someone wants to teach our kids
that Creation is something many people believe is true. This upsets you, not that they are
now teaching kids they cannot tell a boy from a girl, but where the time line starts and
how. The beginning of all things actually has a cause could be taught, verses no one
kn ...[text shortened]... d fossils, oh boy, America is heading towards a theocracy because not all
believe that is true.

Someone might teach their kids that God will torture them in the most extreme way imaginable, for all eternity, if they fail to obey him.

Someone might teach their kids that God will bring a great tribulation on this earth, an unparalleled time of turmoil and distress where no one will be able to buy food or clothing without the mark of the "beast", which will then guarantee their entry into hell.

Someone might teach their daughters they were created to be subservient to men, to never hold authority over men, to be quiet and "in all subjection", and that an ideal woman calls her husband "lord" (1Peter 3:6).

Someone might teach young girls that God ordered women to be stoned to death for premarital sex, with no punishment for boys if they did the same.

Someone might teach children that their natural attraction makes them "abominations".

Someone might teach them to ignore reason, centuries of peer-reviewed data and science, to believe in something that has no evidence whatsoever.

Someone might teach them that their friends who grew up in other faiths, will suffer horribly because it's not their religion.

Someone might tell them that despite God being able to stop evil things that happened to them, their friends, family, and the world around them, that God chose to not to, because he's "mysterious".

Originally posted by @vivify
Someone might teach their kids that God will torture them in the most extreme way imagine, for all eternity, if they fail to obey him.

Someone might teach their kids that God will bring a great tribulation on this earth, a time of turmoil and distress where no one will be able to buy food or clothing without the mark of the "beast", which will then guaran ...[text shortened]... friends, family, and the world around them, that God chose to not to, because he's "mysterious".

Some are teaching kids they cannot tell the difference between boys and girls.
Some are teaching kids its okay for a man to walk into a woman's bathroom.
Some are teaching kids its normal to have sex, go for it to kids.
Some are teaching kids killing the unborn is not taking a human life which is odd since
they cannot tell a boy from a girl, they know what is inside a woman isn't human!

What may or may not be true in the after life is still in the after life verses what is being
done right now in the here and now. You have a issue with what may happen in the
future if there really is or isn't a tribulation but millions are being put to death right now
without ever taking their first breath. When or if the mark of the beast comes that is still
off in the future, but oh heaven forbid someone may not agree with your version of
evolution right now, stop them from teaching their kids that LIE, that LIE, the country
will end if we don't stop them from teaching their kids what you believe is true.

Why not stick with what they are teaching verse what someone may teach, someone
may teach kill anyone who believes in God, someone may teach kids should be taken
away from their parents if they parents don't agree with they think occurred millions or
billions of years ago. Someone may teach thrown them in jail they don't think that fossil
is a million years old. Oh please, get real.

Originally posted by @kellyjay
Some are teaching kids they cannot tell the difference between boys and girls.
Some are teaching kids its okay for a man to walk into a woman's bathroom.
Some are teaching kids its normal to have sex, go for it to kids.
Some are teaching kids killing the unborn is not taking a human life which is odd since
they cannot tell a boy from a girl, they know ...[text shortened]... h thrown them in jail they don't think that fossil
is a million years old. Oh please, get real.

Excellent use of anaphora as a rhetorical device, repetition of an introductory word or phrase in a series of claims in order to lend equivalent validity to them all. Bboth of you. Also used in the I have a dream speech of milk.