Sit Down

Originally posted by darvlay
Will the results of your analysis be as anti-climactic as the Ayn Rand-Emma Goldman debauchle?

Worse.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Worse.

Will there ever be any results?

Originally posted by Nordlys
Will there ever be any results?

Sorry, dozed off there for a few days.
(wipes slobber from mouth)
Uh, YES! There will be any results. I mean, some results.

Sit down for the results, please.

In Christianity, the issue is faith; not works, sin, growth, lack of growth, maturity, lack of maturity, or any other negative or positive proposition. Faith alone in Christ alone. Using an analogy of sitting in a chair with faith in Jesus Christ, while one is free to get up from the chair after having sat on it, one cannot undo the initial sitting.
No matter what anyone does after that 'sitting,' nothing which occurs after that moment of faith can erase the saving faith exhibited.

So, whether a person goes on to blaze new trails in spiritual maturity, or quickly abandons the idea and becomes a Satanist, their faith in Jesus Christ has saved them eternally. They may effect all manner of renouncements and rejection of that faith, but their future is assured: upon death, they will enter heaven.

Of the eleven people who responded to this little non-conclusive survey, two people confessed their salvation (and steadfastness in that faith), two have never decided positively toward the offer, and seven others admitted to have once believed and then turned away from that faith.

Of those seven people, a few hardly ever post in this forum, but the majority of those who rejected their faith do post in this forum. This raises the question: if you are one of the majority, what do you suppose is the impetus behind your attraction to this forum?

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Sit down for the results, please.

In Christianity, the issue is faith; not works, sin, growth, lack of growth, maturity, lack of maturity, or any other negative or positive proposition. Faith alone in Christ alone. Using an analogy of sitting in a chair with faith in Jesus Christ, while one is free to get up from the chair after having sat on it, one ...[text shortened]... one of the majority, what do you suppose is the impetus behind your attraction to this forum?

Another survey?

You're really pulling this out of your ass, aren't you?

I've never been told to sit in the chair, and if the Big J really was just an average carpenter then I'd rather keep my butt splinter free.....

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Sit down for the results, please.

In Christianity, the issue is faith; not works, sin, growth, lack of growth, maturity, lack of maturity, or any other negative or positive proposition. Faith alone in Christ alone. Using an analogy of sitting in a chair with faith in Jesus Christ, while one is free to get up from the chair after having sat on it, one ...[text shortened]... one of the majority, what do you suppose is the impetus behind your attraction to this forum?

so, let me get this right - if you believe in Jesus just once you're saved? That must make alot of mass murderers and rapists happy...

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Sit down for the results, please.

In Christianity, the issue is faith; not works, sin, growth, lack of growth, maturity, lack of maturity, or any other negative or positive proposition. Faith alone in Christ alone. Using an analogy of sitting in a chair with faith in Jesus Christ, while one is free to get up from the chair after having sat on it, one ...[text shortened]... one of the majority, what do you suppose is the impetus behind your attraction to this forum?

"Spirituality" encompasses more than just christianity. However, christianity is one of the most aggressive faiths out there, so its followers tend to dominate the forum. It's also rather popular in the west; even if you reject it completely, you are still surrounded by its followers and forced to consider its claims.

Originally posted by scottishinnz
so, let me get this right - if you believe in Jesus just once you're saved? That must make alot of mass murderers and rapists happy...

Bingo.

Of course, Christ Himself did not hold to such a position...

Originally posted by scottishinnz
so, let me get this right - if you believe in Jesus just once you're saved? That must make alot of mass murderers and rapists happy...

That's one reason why there are quite a few christians who do not believe in the "once saved, always saved" doctrine.

Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
That's one reason why there are quite a few christians who do not believe in the "once saved, always saved" doctrine.

Most Christians, actually.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Sit down for the results, please.

In Christianity, the issue is faith; not works, sin, growth, lack of growth, maturity, lack of maturity, or any other negative or positive proposition. Faith alone in Christ alone. Using an analogy of sitting in a chair with faith in Jesus Christ, while one is free to get up from the chair after having sat on it, one ...[text shortened]... one of the majority, what do you suppose is the impetus behind your attraction to this forum?

I'm presumably one of your seven, although I don't agree with that characterisation as I never seriously considered questions of faith as a five-year-old. I post on this forum because I'm not a very good natural conversationalist but I'm a decent writer; I've never met as large and varied a community as RHP which consistently inspires serious long-term conversation because this medium is perfectly suited to it.

If by 'this forum' you mean 'Spirituality' rather than 'the RHP forae in general', then my attraction has to do with my sense of humour (and I find humour is often closely tied to serious enquiry -- the logical structure of many jokes, for example, is very similar to that of some mathematical proofs).

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Sit down for the results, please.

In Christianity, the issue is faith; not works, sin, growth, lack of growth, maturity, lack of maturity, or any other negative or positive proposition. Faith alone in Christ alone. Using an analogy of sitting in a chair with faith in Jesus Christ, while one is free to get up from the chair after having sat on it, one ...[text shortened]... one of the majority, what do you suppose is the impetus behind your attraction to this forum?

Okay, woah there boy!
A few issues appear here:

1. Since when does abandoning faith turn one into a satanist? I reject the existence of a God, so why would I believe in Satan? I reject the existence of any supernatural entity. You are more likely to be a satanist in my book - but in the end, I couldn't give a rats arse which of the two least likely things in the universe you care to believe in.
But let's be clear - I don't.

2. Now apparently, if you're addition is correct I'm one of the seven who once believed and then turned away. That's not at all true. I told you I sat in the chair. But when did this mean I believed? Sitting in the chair was an analogy for religion - or so I thought. I went to church as a boy - because my Mum dragged me along - but never did this amount to any sort of belief.
In fact, I don't think I was mature enough to understand the nature of belief, until my early twenties, when I'd given up on ever having it at all!

3. My attraction to this forum probably comes from a few different areas. I like to argue about this stuff - do it all the time still with my Mum. I like to read a lot, and reading from a heap of different subject areas - I'm certainly not obsessed with this stuff, but it's one interest I have. I'm a science teacher, so when people start telling me I should be teach about Creation Science, or Intelligent Design, I figure I need to know more about the motivations of the people behind this stuff.
And I'm an atheist, so I really want to know why so many people can continue to be deluded in this way.

Call me a closet religious nut if you like. Call me a satanist if you like. Tell me I secretly believe if you like.
Because of course, you can say whatever you like.

But I know I'm not going to be saved.
And I love it!

Originally posted by royalchicken
I find humour is often closely tied to serious enquiry -- the logical structure of many jokes, for example, is very similar to that of some mathematical proofs).

But you cannot substitute one with the other.

Originally posted by lucifershammer
But you cannot substitute one with the other.

I never claimed otherwise; I merely stated that my primary focus in this forum is to extract the Michael from ideas which deserve no other treatment, and occasionally to criticise and formulate ideas which do deserve serious treatment.

The chair is in the former category.