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Originally posted by sonhouseThrowing the dice?
What part of non-believers thinking maybe a god set up the conditions that led to the big bang, like this god throwing the dice and the universe is what happened but 14 billion years ago.
Exactly what is wrong with people believing that?
Hardly.
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/designun.html
More like fine tuning the universe.
As the site demonstrates, every aspect of the Big Bang had to be just so, otherwise we would not be siting here discussing it.
For example, if the nuclear force constant were larger or smaller, or the gravitational force constant larger or smaller, or if the electromagnetic constant were greater or smaller, or if the expansion of the universe were greater or smaller, or if the mass density of the universe were greater or smaller, and on and on and on, none of would be here.
Originally posted by Rank outsiderGod shared with them what occurred and how, there was no one alive to
They said what they saw, two lights in the sky. They didn't know any better and so made a mistake.
And, although Genesis says that they separate light from darkness, this is also not true, as anyone who has seen the moon in daytime can confirm.
make a mistake when the creation days were going on until man was made.
Kelly
Originally posted by Rank outsiderI don't care what the Qur'an says, if you which to accept that its up to you.
[quote]Sura 71:15-16, states:
See ye not how Allah has created the seven heavens one above another, and made the moon a light (noor) in their midst, and made the sun as a lamp (siraaj)?
The moon is called a light (Arabic: noor) and the sun a lamp (siraaj). Some Muslims claim that since the Qur'an uses different words speaking about the light of t ...[text shortened]... the Greeks had worked this out before Christ came on the scene without any explanation from God)
Since it isn't something I trust as truth I don't bother with it.
Kelly
Originally posted by Pianoman1Yes, child abuse is an attack on children that harms them their full lives and
I'll ignore that petty comment......
And I'm the one who said that teaching the world is less than 10,000 years old is child abuse.
Problem?
sometimes kill them. So you equating teaching something that may or may
not have occurred thousands or billions of years ago to equal child rape
today, or some other that type of child abuse today shows what a sick,
disgusting, and warped brain you have. Your view of people’s faith of
God just plans stands out of a mindless hatred so twisted that you could
view an opinion of what occurred so long ago is as bad as the worse things
that happen to kids today.
Kelly
Originally posted by whodeyYour error is in assuming we are special. If you throw a dice and you get a 5, then it had to be just so in order to get a 5. If you throw the dice 50 times and you get a sequence of 5 numbers then you can again argue that the die had to land just so, otherwise you would not have got that sequence of numbers.
Throwing the dice?
Hardly.
As the site demonstrates, every aspect of the Big Bang had to be just so, otherwise we would not be siting here discussing it.
Earlier in the thread checkbaiter made the claim that the Earth revolves around the sun at precise timing to cause days and nights. As he put it, it is ridiculously false. In fact there is only one possible rotation rate that does not give days and nights. We must excuse him as he simply mindlessly copies off the internet. But I am sure that the origin of the claim was that a specific rotation rate would be needed to give us days and nights of the duration that we experience. But this is trivially obvious and gets back to my dice example above.
So to show that an outcome is not the result of random events you must first show that the outcome is special. Merely stating that a specific set of events is required to achieve the observed outcome does not show that the outcome is not random.
Originally posted by sonhouseDidn't Albert Einstein say that God does not play dice?
What part of non-believers thinking maybe a god set up the conditions that led to the big bang, like this god throwing the dice and the universe is what happened but 14 billion years ago.
Exactly what is wrong with people believing that?
The Instructor
Originally posted by whodeyand if the earth wouldn't have been "fine tuned " for us, maybe a sulfur based whodey would have marveled at how fine tuned his god has made earth, because if anything off would have happened, the planet would have had a poisonous oxygen atmosphere, it would have been too cold to live instead of his warm, temperate 400 degrees celsius. and then he would have had arguments with a sulfur based twhitehead saying how a fine tuned earth is proof god is real.
Throwing the dice?
Hardly.
http://www.godandscience.org/apologetics/designun.html
More like fine tuning the universe.
As the site demonstrates, every aspect of the Big Bang had to be just so, otherwise we would not be siting here discussing it.
For example, if the nuclear force constant were larger or smaller, or the gravitational force consta ...[text shortened]... ss density of the universe were greater or smaller, and on and on and on, none of would be here.
the universe is not fine tuned. we have black holes, gamma bursts, hypernovas, hypervelocity stars and that's only mentioning the extreme stuff. we could all die if the gulfstream decides to call it quits.
the universe is trying to kill you. who knows how many civilizations marveled at how much their god loves them and fine tuned their environments before a comet obliterated them?
Originally posted by twhiteheadI am a musician. I am given to overblown and thoughtless rants. It was a ridiculous thing to say and I am genuinely sorry that I said it. People deservedly took offence and I took note and offered a full public apology. BUT I still stand by my post without the word "sexual".
So would you say you have changed your opinion due to a debate on the subject, or are you merely retracting it to avoid offence, but still believe it to be true?
Originally posted by KellyJayI am disappointed you think I have a sick, disgusting and warped brain. I certainly don't have a mindless twisted hatred of anything in life, even simple moronic and mindless Creationists. I do not get emotionally involved in my beliefs, because that exposes weakness. Yes, incalcating lies in children is wrong and, call me old-fashioned, but I will defend that at all costs.. You, on the other hand, seem a very aggressive person to be so acerbic and vitriolic in your language about me. I am sorry if I have offended you, but truth is sometimes painful to take!
Yes, child abuse is an attack on children that harms them their full lives and
sometimes kill them. So you equating teaching something that may or may
not have occurred thousands or billions of years ago to equal child rape
today, or some other that type of child abuse today shows what a sick,
disgusting, and warped brain you have. Your view of people’s ...[text shortened]... on of what occurred so long ago is as bad as the worse things
that happen to kids today.
Kelly
Originally posted by Pianoman1Boy o boy .. thats a hard lesson - the spoken word is difficult to retract. Youall give the guy a break. He already apologised a dozen times.
I am a musician. I am given to overblown and thoughtless rants. It was a ridiculous thing to say and I am genuinely sorry that I said it. People deservedly took offence and I took note and offered a full public apology. BUT I still stand by my post without the word "sexual".
Originally posted by Pianoman1You take a belief about something that occurred so long ago it only matters
I am disappointed you think I have a sick, disgusting and warped brain. I certainly don't have a mindless twisted hatred of anything in life, even simple moronic and mindless Creationists. I do not get emotionally involved in my beliefs, because that exposes weakness. Yes, incalcating lies in children is wrong and, call me old-fashioned, but I will defend ...[text shortened]... ur language about me. I am sorry if I have offended you, but truth is sometimes painful to take!
to those that think about the beginning of all things, and put it on par with
the more horrific things people can do to children in the here and now. So
yes, I think a mind that would make that connection and put them on par
with each other is twisted.
Kelly
Originally posted by Pianoman1You seem very emotional to me and I also missed this truth you claimed to have revealed. Perhaps you could repeat this truth in CAPITAL LETTERS so the rest of us will not have any trouble picking it out.
I am disappointed you think I have a sick, disgusting and warped brain. I certainly don't have a mindless twisted hatred of anything in life, even simple moronic and mindless Creationists. I do not get emotionally involved in my beliefs, because that exposes weakness. Yes, incalcating lies in children is wrong and, call me old-fashioned, but I will defend ...[text shortened]... ur language about me. I am sorry if I have offended you, but truth is sometimes painful to take!
The Instructor
Originally posted by Rajk999He is still calling it on par with child abuse, he removed the word sexual,
Boy o boy .. thats a hard lesson - the spoken word is difficult to retract. Youall give the guy a break. He already apologised a dozen times.
but the term alone can imply sex as well. He has not changed his tone
he is just getting better at hiding the more putrid parts of his beliefs.
Kelly