@sonship saidI'm an atheist; Christ is not my enemy, and neither are you.
@galveston75
The Atheist and the Jehovah's Witness have a common enemy - Christ.
So they give one another the supportive nod.
You don't get to tell other people who their enemies are.
I'm an atheist; Christ is not my enemy, and neither are you.
You don't get to tell other people who their enemies are.
Whenever you speak of the need for justice in any sense, you are stealing from a God centered reality. The same with rights or dignity. You claim atheism but are stealing from a theistic truth of God's supremeness.
I am sorry.
"For the mind set on the flesh is death, . . . Because the mind set on the flesh is enmity against God; for it is not subject to the law of God, for neither can it be. And those who are in the flesh cannot please God." (Rom. 8:7,8)
This does not mean the mind simply on the physical body.
The expression "the flesh" here denotes the totality of the fallen nature we inherited from Adam.
That means the whole world is against the Father.
The whole world lies in "the evil one" like a passive body under the
operation of an evil physician.
"Because all that is in the world, the lust of the flesh and the lust of the eyes and the vainglory of life, is not of the Father but is of the world. And the world is passing away, and its lust, but he who does the will of God abides forever." (1 John 2:16,17)
Our heart without the mercy of God is incurably wicked. It is deceitful above all things. Our fallen mind is a factory of offenses against God. And out of it proceed evil reasonings rationalizing the evil things we desire to do.
This makes us children of wrath. Without His salvation we are accumulating wrath against ourselves daily because we are infested with the nature of sin.
The feet of the Son of God were nailed through with nails for you and I.
But it is our feet which have taken you to that which offends God.
The hands of the Son of God were nailed through for you and I.
But it is our hands which have reached out and done evil to offend God and
damage ourselves and others.
What you and I have done, the guilt of it has been carried up in His body on the cross that He, in our place, might be judged by God on our behalf.
As we grow we are not neutral. We are enslaved to committing transgressions and offenses against God. So we need to be justified. We need to be reconciled to God. We need to believe in the provision God made for our sick condition even before we came into the world.
Many of us would like to claim neutrality. But the record of our lives will not allow us to claim neutrality. But God does not want us to grovel. He wants us to believe in the Son of God, His perfection, and His atoning death that God might justify us in His eternal redemption.
The MIND set on the flesh is ENMITY against God.
"the flesh" here means the whole fallen humanity which we inherited from our forefather Adam. The mind of the natural man is set on that nature and cannot be except at enmity with God.
We are not neutral coming into the world unregenerate.
We are not object , no dog in this fight neutral. We are at enmity with God and
have no desire to be subject to God.
That is me. That is you, That is a bad sinner. That is a good sinner.
That is the whole world.
[b]"
@sonship saidIs it not possible for you to say all of that in just a couple paragraphs?
@BigDogg
I'm an atheist; Christ is not my enemy, and neither are you.
You don't get to tell other people who their enemies are.
Whenever you speak of the need for justice in any sense, you are stealing from a God centered reality. The same with rights or dignity. You claim atheism but are stealing from a theistic truth of God's supremeness.
...[text shortened]... me. That is you, That is a bad sinner. That is a good sinner.
That is the whole world.
[b]"
So an atheist posts a verse from Luke 18 (also in Matthew 19) and thinks that proves Jesus Christ is not God. The shallow thinking on the atheist’s part is remarkable.
Here is the verse from Luke:
“And Jesus said unto him, Why callest thou me good? none is good, save one, that is, God.”
(Luke 18:19)
And here is the verse in Matthew:
“And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.”
(Matthew 19:17)
First, the atheist apparently thinks - despite all evidence to the contrary - that Jesus Christ’s teachings and statements were so dumbed-down, simplistic and one dimensional that they were designed for a slow-witted child or dullard.
Why did Jesus teach in parables? Why did He speak of the mystery of the Kingdom of God if everything is so simplistic?
Second, the atheist apparently thinks all the Biblical scholars and churches that believe in the Trinity missed that verse.
So what is Jesus saying?
Jesus asks why the rich young ruler calls Him good and says only God is good. Notice Jesus does not say, “I’m not good. Only God is good.”
What Jesus is essentially saying to the rich young ruler is, Do you understand what you’re saying when you call me good? Do you know who you’re speaking to? What do you know about goodness?
Here’s a commentary on the verse in Matthew.
From enduringword.com:
b. Why do you call Me good? In this, Jesus did not deny His own goodness. Instead, He asked the man, “Do you understand what you are saying when you call Me good?”
i. It was as if Jesus said, “You come to Me asking about what good thing you can do to inherit eternal life. But what do you really know about goodness?” “The argument is clear: either Jesus was good, or he ought not to have called him good; but as there is none good but God, Jesus who is good must be God.” (Spurgeon)
c. If you want to enter into life, keep the commandments: Jesus’ answer to the man’s question was straightforward. If you want to gain eternal life by your doing, you must keep the commandments – all of them, and keep them in the fullest sense.
i. “He would needs be saved by doing, Christ sets him that to do which no man living can do, and so shows him his error.” (Trapp)
https://enduringword.com/bible-commentary/matthew-19/
Is it not possible for you to say all of that in just a couple paragraphs?
You're wasting your time and effort attempting to make me to feel embarrassed for writing. I am not ashamed of the Gospel for it is the power of God unto salvation to everyone who believes . . .
Love, grace and divine fellowship are matters God desires to impart INTO man. You think everything those attributes of God is outward, objective, outside, not something of Jehovah poured out into the heart of men.
Paul pioneered living by the Christ who became a life giving Spirit, giving God as life to the insides of man. "the last Adam [Christ] became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor. 15:45)
"Test yourselves whether you are in the faith; prove yourselves. Or do you not realize about yourselves that Jesus Christ in is you, unless you are disapproved? " (2 Cor. 13 5)
He himself said it pleased God at the right time to reveal His Son IN Paul.
"But when it pleased God, who set me apart from my mother's womb and called me through His grace, to reveal His Son in me that I might preach Him among the Gentiles . . . " (Gal. 1:16a)
The kingdom halls have taught you to think "YUK!!" at the Bible's revelation of Christ coming to live within His lovers. The way I said I felt about the NWT - you have a similar feeling about the New Testament.
@sonship
The kingdom halls have taught you to think "YUK!!" at the Bible's revelation of Christ coming to live within His lovers. The way I said I felt about the NWT - you have a similar feeling about the New Testament.
Oh really? The more you tell me about the many things you think you know about the JW's, the more you expose how very little you actually know about us and the bible, which is nothing.... well except for the trinity. You've got that one nailed. Lol
@galveston75 saidAbsolutely!
A question for all? Did Jesus have faith when it came to him facing death?
“Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.”
(Luke 22:42)
“And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.”
(Luke 23:46)
@sonship saidYour error is trying to define reality.
@BigDogg
I'm an atheist; Christ is not my enemy, and neither are you.
You don't get to tell other people who their enemies are.
Whenever you speak of the need for justice in any sense, you are stealing from a God centered reality. The same with rights or dignity. You claim atheism but are stealing from a theistic truth of God's supremeness.
...[text shortened]... me. That is you, That is a bad sinner. That is a good sinner.
That is the whole world.
[b]"
Reality just "is". It remains so regardless of all human narratives in its direction.
@pb1022 saidBut why did he need faith? Does God need faith?
Absolutely!
“Saying, Father, if thou be willing, remove this cup from me: nevertheless not my will, but thine, be done.”
(Luke 22:42)
“And when Jesus had cried with a loud voice, he said, Father, into thy hands I commend my spirit: and having said thus, he gave up the ghost.”
(Luke 23:46)
@galveston75 saidI think you’re disregarding that Jesus Christ, in addition to fully God, was also fully human and was about to undergo a brutal scourging followed by a very painful and prolonged death.
But why did he need faith? Does God need faith?
But He went through that willingly because He knew and trusted the Father’s will.
Here’s another example of Jesus’ faith in the Father’s will:
“Thinkest thou that I cannot now pray to my Father, and he shall presently give me more than twelve legions of angels?
But how then shall the scriptures be fulfilled, that thus it must be?”
(Matthew 26:53-54)
I took your question to mean did Jesus doubt His Father or His Father’s will and the answer to that is obviously “No.”
Nevertheless, Jesus Christ, during His earthly ministry, did not know all that God the Father knows.
Matthew 24:36 is an example.
Now before you say Matthew 24:36 demonstrates Jesus was/is not God, consider what Jesus said in Matthew 26:53 (quoted above.) Jesus could have thwarted His Father’s will by having 12 legions of angels sent from Heaven to rescue Him from His impending scourging and crucifixion. But He didn’t.
@sonship saidYou're also a bit slipshod in throwing out phrases such as 'self contradictory'.
@BigDoggYour error is trying to define reality.
Self contradictory. That's what you are doing trying to state a truism.
Reality just "is". It remains so regardless of all human narratives in its direction.
That I agree with. God is.
"Let God be true and every man a liar." (Rom. 3:4)
You use words without thinking about what they mean.
@galveston75 saidYou are correct. There is a very deep book called "The Two Babylons" by Alexander Hislop a Scottish minister of the early 1900s. He winkles out and explains the origins of a lot of the pagan stuff that Divegeester earlier referenced including the Trinity, how it came about from Babylonian mythos/teaching, and who it originally referred to. Fascinating stuff if you have time, and real eye opener on how badly "Christianity" has become corrupted.
No. Don't even bother. The bible is crystal clear on this subject and there is no trinity. It was conceived in Babylon which is where most false teachings originated.