Originally posted by Ulysses72Them filthy Greeks they ruin this thread big time😵
My friends…
Ulysses is sick. He is very sick. I sat with little 5 ½ months old Pinky over an empty board yesterday and I tried to see her comprehension of the Royal Game. I gave her a white pawn. She immediately placed it on e4!!!! It can’t be!!!! I took it from her and placed it on d4. She immediately moved it again on e4. No my darling I said. Gambit. S ...[text shortened]... activities after the side effects of these experiments.
Cheers.🙂
Thread hi-jacked again....
Originally posted by clearlightI made the basic argument that if you are going to doubt the claim of Jesus' resurrection as recorded in the Bible then you might as well be skeptical about his crucification. I think that is a perfectly reasonable argument and that skepticism over his crucification is far more reasonable than the belief that he was practiced in the art of playing dead. The fact is that the record of his crucification etc was written years after his death and manufacturing that record would be so much easier than playing dead.
I read it carefully and understood it - if my understanding is incorrect it is because there a diffierence between what you wrote and what you meant. I am not a mind reader.
You questioned my reasoning ability just because I made the above perfectly reasonable argument.
It is not in the churches interest to publicise the life of Jesus in Inda which is why his life there may be news to you - it is not news to millions of others.
It is not news to me, I just don't think that it is particularly believable.
This is another example of how you delude yourself with unciritcal thinking.
Again the accusation of uncritical thinking from someone who cant follow a basic argument.
I do not necessarily believe Jesus went to India at all. A lawyer friend of mine told me that in law there is no such thing as the truth - there is only evidense. There is evidense Jesus went to India. Maybe that evidense is correct maybe incorrect but there is evidense. I am only interested in what is verifiable through experience. Fairy stories, myths and obvious biblical lies are of no interest to me. Whats in it for me? Intellectual and spiritual freedom and chance at real liberation not the false of hope of salvation by the non-existant son of a non-existant god.
Yet you are quite ready to believe that Jesus faked his death via some highly elaborate scheme and then went to India. I think you do have a preference for fairy tales.
Originally posted by knightmeisterI see that you keep up asking ToO the same questions again and again.
This may only be coincidence, but the most dishonest people I've come across have all believed in "the propitiatory sacrifice of the christ." Perhaps it's because they don't take responsibility for their actions.----ToO-----
It's not a coincidence. You actively seek out Christians , play mind games with them , refuse to play fair by pretending you a ...[text shortened]... t way of looking at things.
Right now 3 looks the most likely to me )
I cannot see why you consider that, all in all, he is not a Christian. It seems to me that ToO stands simply against specific preconceptions that they distort the essence of the teachings of Jesus as he understands them. On the other hand, ToO's Gospel is crystal clear to this atheist -he is a Christian and he acts according to the Jesus' teachings.
Why is this so hard for you to understand it? And what exactly makes you so sure that you are a Christian and that ToO pretends that he is a Christian?
Originally posted by ThinkOfOneLikewise, unless the person sins outwardly, there's no way for anyone to "prove" that their heart isn't pure. I guess we can add this to your very long list of flawed propositions. The sad thing is that you actually delude yourself into thinking that I have pretty much stopped addressing them because it's "awkward" for me.
[b]"It's not a coincidence. You actively seek out Christians , play mind games with them , refuse to play fair by pretending you are not having a debate when you are , expect them to answer your questions but won't answer their questions ----and then , when they finally get frustrated with you , you can then accuse them of dishonesty and lying...you go in ...[text shortened]... s away to life, and few are they who find it."
---------ToOne---------------------
So why am I the only "liar" who you won't debate with? Is it because you know I can call you out quite easily?
You can't seem to think of anyone who has lived as Jesus commanded they should. Not one single person who has been able to commit to Jesus and actually never needed to confess their sin again?
Your argument is bunk because what is in one's heart will manifest itself in behaviour. Therefore if someone really had been able to attain a state of complete purity we would know by their deeds.
Can you name one person , living or dead , who has attained complete purity of heart so that they have no need of Jesus's sacrifice and no need to confess any sin ( thought or deed)? If not then my original argument stands.
Interestingly you did not cite yourself as an example of such a person . May we assume that you yourself are not pure or cleansed from sin either? If this is true then how come you speak with authority on this subject?
Originally posted by black beetleToO will not say what he is. He will not say if he is a follower of Christ or a believer in the Father who sent Christ. He won't even tell you if he believes in God. All I do is argue with the points he makes and the way he makes them and what I have noticed is that when you put him on the spot he won't give you a simple answer.
I see that you keep up asking ToO the same questions again and again.
I cannot see why you consider that, all in all, he is not a Christian. It seems to me that ToO stands simply against specific preconceptions that they distort the essence of the teachings of Jesus as he understands them. On the other hand, ToO's Gospel is crystal clear to this athe ...[text shortened]... actly makes you so sure that you are a Christian and that ToO pretends that he is a Christian?
He's full of challenges to others but he's basically throwing stones in a glass house because he can't handle being challenged himself. Just watch...you'll see. He'll be gone in a few posts before I get the chance to have him for breakfast. His most recent post was full of rationalisations (notice how he did not address the question) and yet he accuse others of rationalisations. Everything he accuses others of is just a reflection of his own internal world. This forum is basically mirroring back to him what he unconsciously senses within himself.
Originally posted by knightmeisterThat sounds like an accurate description of almost any theist on this forum (including you). I don't see why you have such a problem with it.
All I do is argue with the points he makes and the way he makes them and what I have noticed is that when you put him on the spot he won't give you a simple answer.
Originally posted by knightmeisterAnd why "you have to put him on the spot"? Why a simple conversation cannot be not enough?
ToO will not say what he is. He will not say if he is a follower of Christ or a believer in the Father who sent Christ. He won't even tell you if he believes in God. All I do is argue with the points he makes and the way he makes them and what I have noticed is that when you put him on the spot he won't give you a simple answer.
He's full of challe ...[text shortened]... his forum is basically mirroring back to him what he unconsciously senses within himself.
He is a Christian as far as I am concerned. And Jesus was teaching as any other know teacher of his time -one has to think in order to understand him. Maybe ToO's hermeneutics are different than yours, but I cannot understand why one of you has to be "less" or "more" Christian than the other, just like I cannot understand why a Protestant, an Orthodox, a Catholic etc is "less" or "more" Christian that any other of the Christian lot. This is the reason why there are differ Christian denominations I reckon.
Originally posted by knightmeisterOK my friend, I will try to answer one basic question of yours -the one regarding sin. And maybe our friend ToO will join the conversation is he feels up to it.
ToO will not say what he is. He will not say if he is a follower of Christ or a believer in the Father who sent Christ. He won't even tell you if he believes in God. All I do is argue with the points he makes and the way he makes them and what I have noticed is that when you put him on the spot he won't give you a simple answer.
He's full of challe ...[text shortened]... his forum is basically mirroring back to him what he unconsciously senses within himself.
I do not consider myself sinful -nobody is born sinful. Since the Human established his society he had to set rules, and all the known rules are man-made and not based on the so called "word of god". For me it is enough to respect the secular law -I see no sin in front of “god", I just see crimes against persons, against humanity, against animals, against Life, against the environment.
Methinks I can achieve a better tomorrow once I work hard my virtues based on the evaluation of the mind, and I can do it by means of Philosophy and Science alone. Religion is needless for me, however I stand with all my power for your right to have your own spirituality, your own religion and your own way of life once you commit no crimes and you respect the social consensus that is known as secular law.
Well, how would you evaluate this miserable atheist black beetle?
😵
Originally posted by knightmeister"You can't seem to think of anyone who has lived as Jesus commanded they should. Not one single person who has been able to commit to Jesus and actually never needed to confess their sin again?...Can you name one person , living or dead , who has attained complete purity of heart so that they have no need of Jesus's sacrifice and no need to confess any sin ( thought or deed)? If not then my original argument stands."
Likewise, unless the person sins outwardly, there's no way for anyone to "prove" that their heart isn't pure. I guess we can add this to your very long list of flawed propositions. The sad thing is that you actually delude yourself into thinking that I have pretty much stopped addressing them because it's "awkward" for me.
---------ToOne------------- ...[text shortened]... sin either? If this is true then how come you speak with authority on this subject?
I don't know what you don't understand about what I posted earlier:
"It's likely that a large percentage of those who have made deathbed commitments fit this criteria." Besides the entire premise of your "challenge" is flawed as I also explained earlier. Whether or not you believe it possible does not change what Jesus taught.
"Your argument is bunk because what is in one's heart will manifest itself in behaviour. Therefore if someone really had been able to attain a state of complete purity we would know by their deeds.
Once again, I don't know what you don't understand about what I posted earlier:
"If you want to go by a person's heart, there is no way for another human being to be able 'prove' another's heart is pure is there? Likewise, unless the person sins outwardly, there's no way for anyone to 'prove' that their heart isn't pure.
While a person's actions can demonstrate a heart that is not pure, there is no way that a human being can say with absolute certainty that another human being's heart is pure. There's always the chance that the person was merely "playing the part".
"So why am I the only "liar" who you won't debate with? Is it because you know I can call you out quite easily?
You really struggle comprehending certain concepts. I guess that many that tried to reason with you in your myriad "time" threads can attest to that. Try reading my earlier post as well as my responses in this one.
Add to that your habit of making unfounded accusations, misrepresenting my position, hijacking unrelated threads to badger me, etc. and it shouldn't take a rocket scientist to understand why. Evidently this is another one of those concepts that you struggle to comprehend.
If nothing else, hopefully you dropped your "goading" theory because you did comprehend how poorly thought out it was. Maybe there is a glimmer of hope for you.
Originally posted by knightmeisterirrelevant
[b]ToO will not say what he is. He will not say if he is a follower of Christ or a believer in the Father who sent Christ. b]
John1 1In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2He was with God in the beginning.
3Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4In him was life, and that life was the light of men. 5The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood[a] it.
Originally posted by black beetleOuououou ypage opisw mou apogone tou exapodw. Ei8e na timwrh8eis se aiwnio egkleismo sta tartara kai na ypoxrew8eis na akous mono Kaith Garmph se 24wro martyrio. Ouououou....🙂
OK my friend, I will try to answer one basic question of yours -the one regarding sin. And maybe our friend ToO will join the conversation is he feels up to it.
I do not consider myself sinful -nobody is born sinful. Since the Human established his society he had to set rules, and all the known rules are man-made and not based on the so called "word o ...[text shortened]... nown as secular law.
Well, how would you evaluate this miserable atheist black beetle?
😵
To whom it may concern. If the above seems Greek to you, don't bother. It is Greek.🙂
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Originally posted by Ulysses72oh Yannis, my friend, finally i find the time and the occasion with which to congratulate you on the choice of name of the little beauty! Alexandra, is it not beautiful! and furthermore what joy it brings me to find that she is a natural 1.e4 player, ah, as the Christ states, 'out of the mouths of Babes!, not only that but she resists the nefarious attempts of her uncle blackbeetle in his vain addiction to that ancient religious practice of Zen with its insistence on a wan dot dee four universe! unmentionable horrors await the practitioner of such a course even as the Sirens beckoned Jason and the Argonauts towards the cliffs and rocks. was not the brave Odysseus, who desired to hear the sound of the Sirens a 1.e4 player! was not the scientific and noble Thucydides, a man noted for his freedom from myth and attention to detail, a 1.e4 player! and alas, as beetle has noted, the current reigning ladies world champion, Mrs Alexandra Kostinuek, namesake of our little beauty, also a 1.e4 player. What happiness it brings!
Ouououou ypage opisw mou apogone tou exapodw. Ei8e na timwrh8eis se aiwnio egkleismo sta tartara kai na ypoxrew8eis na akous mono Kaith Garmph se 24wro martyrio. Ouououou....🙂
To whom it may concern. If the above seems Greek to you, don't bother. It is Greek.🙂
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Originally posted by knightmeister"Everything he accuses others of is just a reflection of his own internal world. This forum is basically mirroring back to him what he unconsciously senses within himself."
ToO will not say what he is. He will not say if he is a follower of Christ or a believer in the Father who sent Christ. He won't even tell you if he believes in God. All I do is argue with the points he makes and the way he makes them and what I have noticed is that when you put him on the spot he won't give you a simple answer.
He's full of challe his forum is basically mirroring back to him what he unconsciously senses within himself.
an excellent observation, put quite eloquently!
here is verse for thought, taken from Psalm 26, a psalm of David, really it has to do with integrity, but highlights the folly of communing with those who hide what they are! Psalm 26:4
I have not sat with men of untruth;
And with those who hide what they are I do not come in
Originally posted by Ulysses72Efyges entelos sinonomate dike mou, tha pane oloi tous oi kounimenoi gia tsai ama skasoume ligaki ellinika edo mesa😵
Ouououou ypage opisw mou apogone tou exapodw. Ei8e na timwrh8eis se aiwnio egkleismo sta tartara kai na ypoxrew8eis na akous mono Kaith Garmph se 24wro martyrio. Ouououou....🙂
To whom it may concern. If the above seems Greek to you, don't bother. It is Greek.🙂