What are you still doing here?

Originally posted by twhitehead
If its so easy then find it yourself and cut and paste. If you think I am going to go look it up, you are mistaken.
As for the other thread, it took you 14 posts to actually explain what the whole thread was about. What is the point of starting a thread if you cant say what you want to in the first few posts?
How would you feel if I started a thread on ...[text shortened]... at the arguments are because I am hoping you will go out and buy the book and get converted.

If i was really interested then yes i would go and read it... i like to think that people have a mind of there own and not lazy in finding out new things for themselves... i expressed how much i enjoyed it and that was that... regarding Malachi... someone already found it interesting and looked it up so spares you getting up off your behind and looking it up... i recommend you do that in future as i KEEP saying and you keep ignoring this part.... you may find other things that answer your religious questions and who knows you might,just might be enlightened by it....i can only wait with baited breath!!!

Originally posted by duecer
please reread my post, I do not say Christ only, but embracing the tenents of whatever faith you hold, and yes secular humanism is a religion.

Christ or whatever God or prophet, I meant. I have no faiths, and no faith is required to save to world, nor any religion. By the contrary, religions and faiths have been the poles of conflict in the globe for many ages. Secular humanism a religion? We have different concepts of religion, then. Religion must have a God.

Originally posted by serigado
"Entropy, Order Parameters and Complexity", by James Sethna, Oxford Press
You are worth it too.
I'll paraphrase the first paragraph.

"Many systems in nature are far too complex to analyze directly, [...] despite this, such systems often show simple, striking behavior. Statistical mechanics explains the simple behavior of complex systems"

You'll lear ...[text shortened]... n never be taken as a starting point to make affirmations about your life. No book can.

Interesting...i may just get that book and have a read!!!

Originally posted by Jay Joos
Interesting...i may just get that book and have a read!!!

It's availabe online (legally) in
http://pages.physics.cornell.edu/sethna/StatMech/EntropyOrderParametersComplexity.pdf

Somewhere the formulas and reasoning might get a little difficult, but at least you can read the intros to the chapters. Never take anything for granted. Always question everything.

Originally posted by serigado
It's availabe online (legally) in
http://pages.physics.cornell.edu/sethna/StatMech/EntropyOrderParametersComplexity.pdf

Somewhere the formulas and reasoning might get a little difficult, but at least you can read the intros to the chapters. Never take anything for granted. Always question everything.

Thanks...im open to that...will let you know how i get on.

Originally posted by twhitehead
Surely a shortcut to heaven would be a greater reward? Or isn't heaven all its cracked up to be?

By your thinking, I'm certain such a proposition sounds good. God has other plans, and (as near as I can tell) thus far, His seems to be working much better than would yours.

Originally posted by serigado
God is a physicist doing an experiment. He's testing us, and in the end only the strong willed guys who were brave enough to deny God will be saved. Why would an all powerful God want worshiping and submission? It just doesn't make sense, unless God has as ego to fulfill.

Why would an all powerful God want worshiping and submission? It just doesn't make sense, unless God has as ego to fulfill.-----------------------------------------

....he wants it for you not for him....stop projecting your own ego on to him.

Originally posted by knightmeister
Why would an all powerful God want worshiping and submission? It just doesn't make sense, unless God has as ego to fulfill.-----------------------------------------

....he wants it for you not for him....stop projecting your own ego on to him.

For me? What would I have to gain by submitting? Couldn't I just love God without the diminishing part? Must I do it as a "proof" to him?
What if I refuse to do it and I am a good person? According to the religious boys I would go to hell for eternity. Would that be god's justice? I'll never acknowledge a God with such a sense of justice.

Originally posted by serigado
For me? What would I have to gain by submitting? Couldn't I just love God without the diminishing part? Must I do it as a "proof" to him?
What if I refuse to do it and I am a good person? According to the religious boys I would go to hell for eternity. Would that be god's justice? I'll never acknowledge a God with such a sense of justice.

You apparently haven't examined your standard of "justice" far enough.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
You apparently haven't examined your standard of "justice" far enough.

All heathens shall go to hell. That's just.
With that sense of justice I bet you are american. No wonder there are so many Christians there... they must all feel very cozy with the Christian regime.

Originally posted by twhitehead
If you have already been 'saved' or your salvation is guaranteed, then why hasn't God taken you to heaven yet? If he is all loving, then surely he would spare you any possible further suffering here on earth? So does he not love you that much or is your salvation not guaranteed?

If he is all loving, then surely he would spare you any possible further suffering here on earth? So does he not love you that much or is your salvation not guaranteed?----whitey-----

You make an assumption about love and it's relationship with suffering. The kind of love you have in mind is maybe a sickly , soft love that avoids anything that is hard or difficult and cannot endure through suffering. God's love is a tough love that can walk through suffering and be perfected via suffering. You also neglect to think that salvation also involves service to others which means that us guys do need to hang around to help you lot find God. Maybe God would like to take us all away from the suffering , but there is still so much to do.......

Originally posted by serigado
All heathens shall go to hell. That's just.
With that sense of justice I bet you are american. No wonder there are so many Christians there... they must all feel very cozy with the Christian regime.

All heathens shall go to hell. That's just.
Book? Chapter? Verse? I don't recall that particular sentiment in the Bible.

By what standard should entrance to heaven be judged--- according to you?

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]All heathens shall go to hell. That's just.
Book? Chapter? Verse? I don't recall that particular sentiment in the Bible.

By what standard should entrance to heaven be judged--- according to you?[/b]

Of course that is not written in the Bible. But many believe in it, by their own interpretation of the verses.

By what standard should entrance to heaven be judged--- according to you?
All people go there. Those who don't behave go to prison for a few time. Since there's an allmighty God I believe all people would behave OK. Chance of getting away with a crime would be 0, and God would always know of it, so it wouldn't make sense to commit a crime. (i guess you call it "sin"😉

Throwing someone to Hell (eternal punishment) is not very just or educative, you must agree. If God loves us all, he would be always open to true redemption, even for convicted fellows. But that's not how it is, according to the Bible (don't ask me for the verses). We must prove ourselves in this world and then face eternal Heaven or eternal Hell.
What do you believe? Hell was invented by men to attract people to this religion (by fear), or did God create Hell and this stupid laws? For me it's quite obvious.

Originally posted by serigado
Of course that is not written in the Bible. But many believe in it, by their own interpretation of the verses.

By what standard should entrance to heaven be judged--- according to you?
All people go there. Those who don't behave go to prison for a few time. Since there's an allmighty God I believe all people would behave OK. Chance of getting away w ...[text shortened]... igion (by fear), or did God create Hell and this stupid laws? For me it's quite obvious.[/b]

Of course that is not written in the Bible. But many believe in it, by their own interpretation of the verses.
To their own shame.

All people go there.
Is it really heaven if someone doesn't want to be there?

Throwing someone to Hell (eternal punishment) is not very just or educative, you must agree.
What about opening the door for someone? Is that polite? God, the consummate gentleman, simply opens doors to accomodate every man's personal choice.

If God loves us all, he would be always open to true redemption, even for convicted fellows.
And open, He is. Seek the Lord while He may be found...

We must prove ourselves in this world and then face eternal Heaven or eternal Hell.
Prove? The word you're searching for is faith. Not as rigorous as you make it sound.

... or did God create Hell and this stupid laws? For me it's quite obvious.
Hell was created for Satan and the fallen angels. Some of mankind demanded equal access...

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
[b]Of course that is not written in the Bible. But many believe in it, by their own interpretation of the verses.
To their own shame.

All people go there.
Is it really heaven if someone doesn't want to be there?

Throwing someone to Hell (eternal punishment) is not very just or educative, you must agree.
What about opening the doo ...[text shortened]...
Hell was created for Satan and the fallen angels. Some of mankind demanded equal access...[/b]

You didn't address the point: How can a just and loving. God simply send someone forever to eternal punishment?
It seems that during lifetime we have all the time to repent and find God, but after we die, we simply go to Heaven or Hell, and that's it. I don't share God's policy on this point.

From what I get from Heaven, we won't be able to sin. We won't have free will, and seems quite the boring place. It's only the least bad of the two alternatives.