What are you still doing here?

Originally posted by serigado
Last time I had a debate with a priest, he started crying saying I made him lose his faith and that I was the anti-christ.
I was not very happy for that, since then I never used my rhetoric to persuade anyone on matters of faith. I guess it's better to live in ignorance and be happy. But I'll fight to have children be properly educated, without falling in the emotional pit religion offers.

What a coincidence. I once debated an atheist until they broke down in tears and said they just could'nt live without God and his love any more and that person was me. 😉

The salvation we get, is for this world. We live in a world where people buy and sell each other, where we kill each other for sport, where children become sexual objects, where widows and orphans are left to fend for themselves. This world is profoundly broken. The reason is simple...sin. By accepting Christ, or embracing, truly embracing the tenents of your specific religion, we begin down the path of spiritual healing and reconciliation with God, and our fellow human beings. The salvation that God offers is for this world, for this life, the afterlife will take care of itself.

Originally posted by Jay Joos
Depends if you believe in the particular religion... otherwise i cant object to a childs proper education!!!

Proper = No indoctrination, and child learns all religions and their drawbacks at the same level. No "sunday school" and no brainwashing.

Originally posted by whodey
What a coincidence. I once debated an atheist until they broke down in tears and said they just could'nt live without God and his love any more and that person was me. 😉

We must debate, then.
Unfortunately my english isn't so good, but I think I can get you to the point where your God lives only in your head.
But first I would have to know where you base your faith in a God, what took you to accept that there must be a God waiting for you. Bible? Friends? Family? And is that faith necessary to live in our world, or only to perpetuate your life after death?

Originally posted by duecer
The salvation we get, is for this world. We live in a world where people buy and sell each other, where we kill each other for sport, where children become sexual objects, where widows and orphans are left to fend for themselves. This world is profoundly broken. The reason is simple...sin. By accepting Christ, or embracing, truly embracing the tenents of your ...[text shortened]... vation that God offers is for this world, for this life, the afterlife will take care of itself.

Christ is not the solution.
A philosophy like Christ defended is ONE of the possible solutions, nothing more, nothing less.

Originally posted by twhitehead
If you have already been 'saved' or your salvation is guaranteed, then why hasn't God taken you to heaven yet? If he is all loving, then surely he would spare you any possible further suffering here on earth? So does he not love you that much or is your salvation not guaranteed?

Because we play apart in each other hearing the Word, and your still
not ready to meet God.
Kelly

Originally posted by Jay Joos
T.head... i hope you read Freaky's reply and note in particular "Forcing others to (once again) crack open the book"

That is why in my Malachi thread i refrained from quoting the bible...it makes you look it up and who knows what other little treasures your eyes may fall upon in the good book... try it sometime and you might just find the answers you see ...[text shortened]... on a chess forum...maybe you should go to church and ask a vicar these questions you have!!!

Sorry but I do not have a Bible and cant be bothered to go look it up on the internet. If you are too lazy to type it out then I guess I will never know what the verse was. Now how do you explain your refusal to give your own opinion on the verse? I can't look that up anywhere.

Originally posted by FreakyKBH
Great question.

Life--- for the believer--- is about reward. The quest in all of this for the believer is to grow in grace and in the knowledge of the Lord Jesus Christ. We who remain now are here for the express purpose of being blessed right in the middle of the enemies camp (see Psalm 23:5 for one example of this concept).

Surely a shortcut to heaven would be a greater reward? Or isn't heaven all its cracked up to be?

Originally posted by twhitehead
Sorry but I do not have a Bible and cant be bothered to go look it up on the internet. If you are too lazy to type it out then I guess I will never know what the verse was. Now how do you explain your refusal to give your own opinion on the verse? I can't look that up anywhere.

If you read my answer you will see my opinion in it... you are too lazy to look it up on the internet??? and you call ME lazy...

1.Get a bible and read it
2. Look on the internet and read it(surely tapping a keyboard isn't too difficult!!!)

Those 2 points are my opinion shortened...i refuse to type it out to make people look it up and enjoy it themselves and as i said before....you might just read an answer to your many questions you seek on a chess forum....

Took that in? good.....

Originally posted by Jay Joos
If you read my answer you will see my opinion in it... you are too lazy to look it up on the internet??? and you call ME lazy...

1.Get a bible and read it
2. Look on the internet and read it(surely tapping a keyboard isn't too difficult!!!)

Those 2 points are my opinion shortened...i refuse to type it out to make people look it up and enjoy it themse ...[text shortened]... read an answer to your many questions you seek on a chess forum....

Took that in? good.....

Usually when I see a reference from the Bible, I just skip the post. Make others look it up? Bible's not worth it.

Originally posted by serigado
We must debate, then.
Unfortunately my english isn't so good, but I think I can get you to the point where your God lives only in your head.
But first I would have to know where you base your faith in a God, what took you to accept that there must be a God waiting for you. Bible? Friends? Family? And is that faith necessary to live in our world, or only to perpetuate your life after death?

I am not sure you could say it was any one thing, rather, it was a combination of things. Mostly, however, I felt drawn to my faith for whatever reason as if I were being called. Crazy huh?

Having said that, it is not like I am committing intellectual suicide by embracing my faith. On the one hand I cannot prove my faith but on the other hand I have evidences for my faith.

Originally posted by serigado
Usually when I see a reference from the Bible, I just skip the post. Make others look it up? Bible's not worth it.

But you are worth it!

Originally posted by Jay Joos
But you are worth it!

"Entropy, Order Parameters and Complexity", by James Sethna, Oxford Press
You are worth it too.
I'll paraphrase the first paragraph.

"Many systems in nature are far too complex to analyze directly, [...] despite this, such systems often show simple, striking behavior. Statistical mechanics explains the simple behavior of complex systems"

You'll learn a lot about yourself, your world and reality if you ever understand the concepts in this book. You'll understand God simply doesn't make sense, although you can fit one in this world if it pleases, he's not really necessary.
The Bible was written by men, is not divine, has errors, and can never be taken as a starting point to make affirmations about your life. No book can.

Originally posted by Jay Joos
Took that in? good.....

If its so easy then find it yourself and cut and paste. If you think I am going to go look it up, you are mistaken.
As for the other thread, it took you 14 posts to actually explain what the whole thread was about. What is the point of starting a thread if you cant say what you want to in the first few posts?
How would you feel if I started a thread on "The God Delusion" With something like this:
I love chapter two of "the God Delusion", it proves without doubt that there is no God. Would anyone care to dispute the arguments he gives?
And then I refuse to tell you what the arguments are because I am hoping you will go out and buy the book and get converted.

Originally posted by serigado
Christ is not the solution.
A philosophy like Christ defended is ONE of the possible solutions, nothing more, nothing less.

please reread my post, I do not say Christ only, but embracing the tenents of whatever faith you hold, and yes secular humanism is a religion.