What is important to God?

Originally posted by Rank outsider
I agree. I was trying to express the difference between expressing a belief which could be regarded as a crime (of which there are many examples) and the idea of a God monitoring you 24/7 so that any silent thought can become a crime, rather like the screens in 1984. Hence the reference to dystopia.

But I agree this is just thought crime taken to a more sophisticated and sinister level even than 1984.

But the supposed 'crime' here has nothing to do with whether you are being monitored 24/7 or what your stray silent thoughts might be. The issue is whether or not it is reasonable to punish someone for not believing something despite the lack of convincing evidence. Many people today express their beliefs quite openly without you having to read their thoughts at all. And some countries punish those holding beliefs quite severely.

I realize that we dislike being monitored 24/7, but we seem to accept it in most public spaces where CCTV is quite common. Some people even revel in it by posting on Twitter or Facebook non-stop.

Originally posted by sonship
Satan's fangs are so deeply sunk into your mind dripping old, old poisonous venom against all that is Divine, that you would call the Bible's truth gibberish.

So King of Rats,

1) Where did you come from?
2) Why are you alive?
3) And what is your destiny?

"Satan's fangs"

🙄

Is this literal, by the way? Does Satan literally have fangs implanted in my brain and is he literally "dripping old, poisonous venom" in my brain that is then altering my behavior? If not literal, how is Satan affecting my behavior?

As for your questions:

1) From stardust
2) Don't know why life began.
3) Death

Originally posted by Great King Rat
Is this literal, by the way? Does Satan literally have fangs implanted in my brain and is he literally "dripping old, poisonous venom" in my brain that is then altering my behavior? If not literal, how is Satan affecting my behavior?

It also begs the question how he knows that he is not a victim of some other Satan like entity that is causing his own delusions.

Also, how would asking you three simple questions get rid of Satan's poison? Surely something more than that is required?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
There is no logic in a god placing importance on "faith".
And an illogical god seems ... well ... illogical!

Spoken like an unbeliever. Imagine that.

How can you not understand the importance of faith to God (or even 'a god' )?

God wants people to believe in him. All else follows from this simple beginning.

Originally posted by Suzianne
Spoken like an unbeliever. Imagine that.

How can you not understand the importance of faith to God (or even 'a god' )?

God wants people to believe in him. All else follows from this simple beginning.

Without any reason whatsoever.

It's not God that you believe in. It's the bible, and even worse, it's the people that told you that the bible contains God's words, that you have complete faith in.

That is entirely illogical.

Originally posted by twhitehead
But the supposed 'crime' here has nothing to do with whether you are being monitored 24/7 or what your stray silent thoughts might be. The issue is whether or not it is reasonable to punish someone for not believing something despite the lack of convincing evidence. Many people today express their beliefs quite openly without you having to read their thou ...[text shortened]... e CCTV is quite common. Some people even revel in it by posting on Twitter or Facebook non-stop.

There are two kinds of 'thought crimes'.

One (a 'pure' thought crime) is where the holding of a belief is a crime in itself. Expressing those beliefs by word or deed are part of the proof that the person holds those beliefs.

Another (an 'expressed' thought crime) is where the holding of a belief is not a crime in itself, but the expression of that belief is. So simply believing that the Holocaust did not happen is not (usually) a crime in itself, but expressing it is in some countries. (BTW - I think these are still very bad laws, but that is for another debate).

I had set all my comments in terms of whether God had created a valid justice system. One other aspect of such a system has to be whether an individual can avoid transgressing the law, even those laws that the person does not support.

In the case of a 'pure' thought crime in the real world, a person (providing he/she is very careful) could avoid prosecution by not breathing a word of their beliefs to anyone and continuing to act on a day-to-day basis in the manner expected. They are still committing a crime, but there is no means to know that this is the case.

In an 'expressed' thought crime, things are that much easier, as you simply have to avoid expressing the thought, in which case no crime as been committed.

However, the 24/7 silent and invisible monitor is important here. As you say, it has nothing to do with whether you have committed a crime, but it goes to the heart of whether or not the system of justice is legitimate.

In the case of God, the system:

1 Sets up the impossible standard that people are required to believe what they don't.

2 Makes it impossible to avoid judgment even if they are willing to modify their words and actions to feign compliance.

Any system of justice that essentially ensures that a person will be condemned for a crime which they cannot avoid committing is no system of justice.

The only issue I would take with your comments is that you say:

The issue is whether or not it is reasonable to punish someone for not believing something despite the lack of convincing evidence.

I do not think the last few words are relevant. Whether the belief is reasonable or not, I do not think someone should ever be punished for simply holding a belief.

In fact, with very few exceptions, I don't believe it should be a crime to express those thoughts either. Hence I don't support 'Holocaust denial laws' when those laws make it a crime simply to express that view (which not all do).

Originally posted by Great King Rat
Without any reason whatsoever.

It's not God that you believe in. It's the bible, and even worse, it's the people that told you that the bible contains God's words, that you have complete faith in.

That is entirely illogical.

You say that as if you know that God isn't real and the reason for our faith.

Repetition is in order. I will say pretty much the same thing, yet express it somewhat differently.

To see what is of utmost important to God you can to go to the conclusion of the divine revelation. All the 66 books of the divine revelation of the Bible have their grand climax in the last two chapters of the Bible - Revelation 21 and 22.

But there is much symbolism there. What we there is a new heaven and new earth.
But the capital and central thing in this new universe is a city. But what a city it is.

1.) The city is called a Bride for Christ - so the city matches Christ a loving other.

2.) The city is a temple for God. That is a place where God lives and man worships.

3.) The city is really a mountain of gold. That means a huge mount corporate entity constituted with the very divine nature of God Himself.

4.) It is a mountain lampstand of sorts. That means it carries a universal light. That is a city as a capital which shines out the enlightenment and truth essential to all human life.

There is much symbolism to express very profound spiritual matters. But we needn't despair and afraid that wild interpretations will take over. To find the significance of symbolic things in the Bible one has to find where else in the Bible those things are spoken of.

The Bible interprets itself in many profound allegorical matters.

5.) At the top of this mountain city is a throne - it is "the throne of God and of the Lamb". The very center is a throne of divine administration of all creation. And it is a throne [singular] of God and of the Lamb (the Redeemer). The central administration is in the hands of God-man - Jesus the Redeemer within Whom lives the eternal God.

6.) From the throne of God pours forth the river of water of life. So this is a city of God - the Father, God - the Son as the Lamb, and God - the Holy Spirit as the flowing out of God into all of the city as eternal life.

The Triune God is the source of this eternal city.

7.) In the city grows the tree of life as a vine tree. This means man is brought back to God's original purpose. That is to "eat" God Himself, bringing God into himself.

And there is much, much more showing the consummation of God's work. The climax of the Bible reveals what is important to God.

Finally, here is a verse showing that God created all things for this, His will. All things exist for this purpose.

" You are worthy, our Lord and God, to receive the glory and the honor and the power, for You have created all things, and because of Your will they were and were created." (Revelation 4:11)

This does not mean that simply because of God's will power all things were created. Rather it means that because of God's will as His plan and His purpose, all things were created.

Don't listen to any stupid scoffer dismissing this as "gibberish". Such a mocker knows nothing has probably been in the dark so long he is afraid of the light.

Originally posted by sonship
Repetition is in order. I will say pretty much the same thing, yet express it somewhat differently.

To see what is of utmost important to God you can to go to the conclusion of the divine revelation. All the 66 books of the divine revelation of the Bible have their grand climax in the last two chapters of the Bible - [b]Revelation 21 and 22.

Bu ...[text shortened]... h". Such a mocker knows nothing has probably been in the dark so long he is afraid of the light.[/b]

Gibberish.

So I submitted the conclusion of the Bible to speak of things important to God.
The beginning of the Bible also could be consulted.

In the six days of Genesis 1 the climax involves what is really important to God.

Man, being not a accident or mistake, but a purposeful crown of creation and being made in the image of God.

With all other items leading up to Genesis 1:26,27 it just says God made this or made that. When it comes to humanity God holds a council with God and says something new "Let Us". The Triune God is involved in this crowning act of creating the apex of His creation.

"And God said, Let Us make man in Our image, according to Our likeness; and let them have dominion over the fish of the sea and over the birds of heaven and over the cattle and over all the earth and over every creeping thing that creeps upon the earth.

And God created man in His own image; in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them." (Gen. 1:26,27)

God wants man to look like Him.
God wants man to have dominion on His behalf.
God wants man to represent Him and reign for Him over all that He has created.

The next day, the seventh day, is a day in which God rests. This is not rest because of fatigue. God is not tired there. It is a rest of satisfaction. It is rest of God being happy with what He has arranged - man created in His image with His likeness as a deputy authority over all that He has created.

Originally posted by Suzianne

God wants people to believe in him. All else follows from this simple beginning.

Apart from "somebody told me" how do you come to this conclusion?

What good does it do god or mankind?
What is the point?

Originally posted by Suzianne...

God wants people to believe in him. All else follows from this simple beginning.

The belief must be based on faith. Not on morality or ethics, not on thinking ability.
Have faith belief that He exists, or suffer torment for eternity.

That is what the Christian God wants, according to the Bible.

Originally posted by apathist
The belief must be based on faith. Not on morality or ethics, not on thinking ability.
Have faith belief that He exists, or suffer torment for eternity.

That is what the Christian God wants, according to the Bible.

I disagree beliefs can be based upon anything, my faith isn't based upon nothing either.

With respect to why anyone is going to suffer torment, that will be because of their sins.
Where it is true the salvation offered to man is rooted in faith, the cause for that suffering
will be due to the sins of ones life. That is according to the Bible not that things you've
just said.

Originally posted by KellyJay
For those that do not believe in God feel free to give what you think would
be important if God were real.

I have no idea what a god or gods would find important if they existed.

Due to the problem of evil I know for a fact that no morally good gods exist that know about/care about us.

Beyond that I have no idea.

But the question I would want to ask first is... Why should I, or anyone else, care what is important to a god
or gods if they existed?

Originally posted by twhitehead
..... but we seem to accept it in most public spaces where CCTV is quite common. .....

Who is this WE?

I and others like me are fighting quite hard against such invasions of privacy.