Originally posted by sonshipGibberish.
What is important to God is Christ His Son.
That is not only Christ Himself but Christ wrought and dispensed into man.
The uniting of divinity with humanity for a oneness of God and man is why He created the universe. And it is also why He did all things including coming to die a redemptive death and rise again and come as Spirit to indwell.
The last ...[text shortened]... into His saved people.
Read more at http://www.godseconomy.org/
If i managed to create new intelligent life, and was in essence a God to the creatures i had created, i wouldn't be obsessed with being worshiped and obeyed. What would be important to me (as their God) would be their happiness and independence. I would though watch over them and would certainly intervene if i saw suffering or injustice.
Originally posted by KellyJayThere are two different questions being asked here:
For those that do not believe in God feel free to give what you think would
be important if God were real.
(1) What would God think is important, and
(2) What should God think is important.
If God is real, number 2 is obvious. But if God is real, number 1 is rather frightening, because God would believe sending "sinners" to suffer the worst form of torture for all eternity is important.
Originally posted by KellyJayIf God were real, and is to stand in judgement of us, then he should abide by the normal principles of what makes a valid justice system. In any human context, I imagine most theists would agree with the following principles, but where God is concerned they are simply overlooked.
For those that do not believe in God feel free to give what you think would
be important if God were real.
1 The rules we are expected to abide by should be sufficiently clear that the person being judged should be able to understand whether or not they have committed an offence.
Clearly not the case, as the endless debates about abortion, gay rights etc demonstrate.
2 Any punishment should be proportionate to the crime
Clearly not the case. The punishment for minor transgressions appears to be the same as for the most heinous human rights abuses.
3 People should not be punished for what they believe (or don't).
You cannot choose what you believe. Thought crimes are the stuff of the worst excesses of a dystopia.
4 Torturing people as a punishment is unacceptable. Torturing people for all eternity is infinitely unacceptable, illogical and unnecessary.
There are lots of other things I could add to the list. But this is sufficient to demonstrate that either:
1 God is a hopeless communicator; or
2 God is evil; or
3 God does not exist.
Originally posted by Rank outsiderAlthough I agree with the rest of your post, this sentence I disagree with and is not supported by what preceded it. There was recently a thread about thought crimes and it was interesting that nobody was willing to actually argue a position against having thought crimes. Thought crimes do even exist in most legal systems today.
Thought crimes are the stuff of the worst excesses of a dystopia.
Originally posted by twhiteheadI agree. I was trying to express the difference between expressing a belief which could be regarded as a crime (of which there are many examples) and the idea of a God monitoring you 24/7 so that any silent thought can become a crime, rather like the screens in 1984. Hence the reference to dystopia.
Although I agree with the rest of your post, this sentence I disagree with and is not supported by what preceded it. There was recently a thread about thought crimes and it was interesting that nobody was willing to actually argue a position against having thought crimes. Thought crimes do even exist in most legal systems today.
But I agree this is just thought crime taken to a more sophisticated and sinister level even than 1984.
Originally posted by vivifyWith one group of people (believers), they are not going to be making it up as they go they
There are two different questions being asked here:
(1) What would God think is important, and
(2) What should God think is important.
If God is real, number 2 is obvious. But if God is real, number 1 is rather frightening, because God would believe sending "sinners" to suffer the worst form of torture for all eternity is important.
should be looking at what they know according to their faith. While the second group of
people who do not believe would be answering as if God were real and applying the
question to what they think should be important. So I agree your right, but that was why
I asked what I did.
Originally posted by vivifyI would think that if God is real and there is a danger to us it is a danger due to something
There are two different questions being asked here:
(1) What would God think is important, and
(2) What should God think is important.
If God is real, number 2 is obvious. But if God is real, number 1 is rather frightening, because God would believe sending "sinners" to suffer the worst form of torture for all eternity is important.
quite real. The results of that danger could be worse than its punishment if the outcome
were to continue unchecked.
Originally posted by Rank outsiderI think everyone agreed simply having a thought was not a crime, where myself and others
I agree. I was trying to express the difference between expressing a belief which could be regarded as a crime (of which there are many examples) and the idea of a God monitoring you 24/7 so that any silent thought can become a crime, rather like the screens in 1984. Hence the reference to dystopia.
But I agree this is just thought crime taken to a more sophisticated and sinister level even than 1984.
who agreed that thoughts can be a crime is where the root of actions take hold of the
one having them. Lusting after another's wife is different than having a thought about
her. One of the best analogies I heard was about waves coming in on a beach, those
thoughts are like waves they come and go, we choose which ones we pick to ride our
suffer boards on.
