Originally posted by @fmfThis makes no logical sense, Kiddo.
The moral compass-warping zealotry and vanity of proponents of torturer god theology.
But it makes as much sense as tiger’s view that God, after speaking the world into existence, wandered around heaven in search of lighter fluid and rolled-up newspapers to keep the lake of fire from going out.
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-Removed-I'm looking for the big scary challenge now. Give me a minute to find it.
My reply will be with a heart to salvage something positive and of benefit to lovers of Christ from this contraversy. It will sound like I am talking around some people here. Some will object - Ie. ("Why did you have to write all that ? " )
Essentially I am positive about the whole Bible. If possible I'll emphasize then the beneficial and positive aspects of your problem.
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Originally posted by @fmf
It made him dead, sonship.
Um, don't look now but the entire two thousand plus years of the Christian faith has been focused on the risen Christ. That's the Jesus Christ who after three days did not STAY DEAD.
I know you're kind of slow but Christ resurrected is the cornerstone of the Christian church.
That may have come as a terrible shock to the people who admired him
Let me know when this "terrible shock" of realizing Jesus is dead and gone is suppose to come pounding down on me.
Is it going to happen in the middle of the night?
On my death bed perhaps?
When is this great dark tragic SHOCK - " Oh Jesus didn't rise ! " suppose to come down on me like a sledge hammer of realism ??
I've been through a lot. And through a lot Jesus was always AVAILABLE and REAL to me. And I haven't been through nearly the tribulations and trials of some other Christians who came out on the other side rejoicing that Jesus Christ lives.
Do tell me when to expect this terrible shock to hit me.
and may be the reason a cult of personality was carefully constructed around him in the subsequent decades and centuries - complete with the he-rose-from-the-dead and Doctrine of Atonement parts (eventually) - but the Romans executing him made him dead.
So you're running with a dead Jesus. Well, so was a Jewish zealot of a young scholar by the name of Saul of Tarsus. He was so enthusiastic to wipe out this new cult that he took the initiative to go to the authorities with this kind of tone -
"Look, you give ME the authority. And I'll stamp this thing out at its roots right quick and in a hurry. If you guys are too old to chase this thing down give me the authority to do so. I'll exterminate this Risen Jesus thing entirely and we can all get back to pure Judaism."
However Jesus appeared to Saul, " Saul, Saul, Why do you persecute Me?" and turned him around and right side up. Saul of Tarsus shocked his rabbinical teachers AND the Christian churches by becoming the Apostle Paul.
He wrote about 13 of the 27 New Testament books.
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Originally posted by @sonshipYes. Executing him made him dead. The Romans executed loads of people.It made him dead, sonship.
Um, don't look now but the entire two thousand plus years of the Christian faith has been focused on the risen Christ. That's the Jesus Christ who after three days did not STAY DEAD.
I know you're kind of slow but Christ resurrected is the cornerstone of the Christian church.
[quote]
That may have com ...[text shortened]... tian churches by becoming the Apostle Paul.
He wrote about 13 of the 27 New Testament books.
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Originally posted by @sonshipNot you, silly. The Jewish admirers of this charismatic Jewish rabi who believed he was the Jewish messiah [as he himself may have done] but who suddenly found he was dead, and who set about concocting a theology to explain away the fact that the 'king of the Jews' had been executed. Their shock and reaction 2,000 years ago. Not yours. You're just a reciter of the mythology and a reciter of the Heath Robinson theology.
Do tell me when to expect this terrible shock to hit me.
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FMF warns of the shock of realizing poor Jesus is dead and gone afterall. Maybe Ceasar Nero didn't get the memo. He and other Roman emperors, totally hostile to the "atheistic" Jesus Christ cult, couldn't seem to terrify it out of existence.
(They were considered atheists because they didn't hold the Roman Caesar as a god nor follow the Roman Pantheon of gods).
When Christ told the obscure disciple Ananias to go baptize a new baby Christian by the name of Saul of Tarsus, Ananias protested.
"Lord, we have heard about this dude. He is a bad actor. I wouldn't put it past him to come among us as a spy to wipe out Your church from the inside." [all paraphrased]
Jesus said to Ananias, essentially - " Don't worry. I am going to personally show him how much trouble he'll have to go through for following Me."
This man Paul the Apostle then wrote us this:
"Who shall separate us from the love of Christ? Shall tribulation or anguish or persecution or famine or nakedness or peril or sword?
As it is written, "For Your sake we are being put to death all day long; we have been accounted as sheep for slaughter."
But in all these things we more than conquer through Him who loved us. For I am persuaded that neither death nor life nor angels nor principalities nor things present nor things to come nor powers nor height nor depth nor any other creature will be able to separate us from the love of God,
which is in Christ Jesus our Lord." (Romans 8:35-39)
Originally posted by @fmfThe CONVOLUTION begins.
Not you, silly. The Jewish admirers of this charismatic Jewish rabi who believed he was the Jewish messiah [as he himself may have done] but who suddenly found he was dead, and who set about concocting a theology to explain away the fact that the 'king of the Jews' had been executed. Their shock and reaction 2,000 years ago. Not yours. You're just a reciter of the mythology and a reciter of the Heath Robinson theology.
The total conspiracy nonsense begins.
Might as well also explain why an eternal universe is more believable then one created by a supernatural God transcendent over it.