Robbie,
Your is addressed to me but in response to whodey.
Paul who believed strongly in God admits that he was a blasphemer when he persecuted Jesus.
I suppose this is your answer to this. You quote me Philippians 2:5-11 and add:
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you will naturally note that Christ, quite contrary to your pagan dogma, does not consider himself equal to God,
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What it says is that "though existing in the form of God did not consider being equal with God a treasure to be grasped".
Paul's point is that Christ had every right to think of Himself that way but did not. It is not a matter of Christ humbly putting aside something that He had no claim to or no right to. It is Christ humbly putting away what was legitimately His, ie. being "equal with God".
Robbie, you believe what you want. You are in my prayers of love for you. But this above is the reason why I could not in good conscience use Philippians 2:6-11 to deny that the Word was with God and was God.
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yes, he has an exalted position next to God, quite frankly, as King of Gods Kingdom, that everyone should indeed acknowledge this and respect it as one would of such a personage.
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If you mean that Christ was another lesser god who was next to God, I must reject that for myself. The passage does not say that Christ existed next to God. It says He existed in the form of God. And I have shown you from Isaiah that God knows of NO OTHER GOD.
"I am Jehovah and there is no one else; Besides Me there is no God." (Isaiah 45:5)
So the Philippian teaching of Christ being "in the form of God" and being "equal with God" I cannot take to mean that He was or is another "God" along side of Jehovah.
God says that He knows of no other "Rock" besides Himself as Jehovah God. "And you are My witnesses. Is there a God besides Me? Or is there any [other] Rock? I do not know of [any]? (Isaiah 44:8). Yet the Apostle Paul says that the spiritual Rock of the Old Testament "WAS CHRIST."
" ... for they drank of a spiritual rock which followed them, and the rock was Christ." (1 Cor. 10:4)
The spiritual rock that God used to signify His divine steadfast Being was there in the Exodus. That Rock was Christ. And Jehovah knows of no other God besides Himself and of no other Rock.
Philippians 2 cannot be used to deny that Christ is God incarnated.
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yes, every knee is bending to the Christ in acknowledgment of this, you will note however, that the glory goes to the father, thus it may be similar with the lamb, although your tricky deception would seem to
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But you should also notice that Jehovah God says that the same worship will be had to Him.
" I have sworn by Myself; A word has gone out of My mouth in righteousness and will not return,
That every knee shall bow to Me, and every tongue shall swear. It shall be said of Me, Only in Jehovah is there righteousness and strength." (See Isaiah 45:23,24)
So we cannot use Philippians 2 to deny that Jesus Christ is Jehovah God incarnated to be a man.
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indicate otherwise, but again, we are not buying it, for it is, as usual, conveniently taken out of context to suit your dogmatic reasoning's, your house is abandoned to you! servetus lives, moffat lives, russel lives, arius lives, but the trinity is dead!
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May God have mercy on you. May He have mercy on us.
Your case from Philippians chapter 2 has not stood.
Originally posted by jaywilloh jaywill my friend, i need to go out at present, when i return, we shall talk further, and if anyone needs mercy it is I, for a hopeless sinner is what I am, no doubt, but a trinitarian i am not, your sentiments are appreciated!
Robbie,
Your is addressed to me but in response to whodey.
Paul who believed strongly in God admits that he was a blasphemer when he persecuted Jesus.
I suppose this is your answer to this. You quote me Philippians 2:5-11 and add:
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you will naturally note that Christ, quite contrary ave mercy on us.
Your case from Philippians chapter 2 has not stood.
Originally posted by robbie carrobiehere is were i find some flaws in your reasoning. John 14-17 is known as the 'farewell address'. In it Christ fills in the gap's of knowledge that the disciples had yet to divine for themselves.
alas no, for when you look in the mirror, you see your reflection, it is an image representative of you, but not you yourself and the words of Philippians quoted above clearly indicates that this is not the case, also, 'the father is greater than I', etc etc etc.
In 14:9 he literally says that those who have seen him have seen the father, it is a rather unambiguous statement. He doesn't say he who has seen me has seen a reasonble facsimile of the father, or a representation of the father.
In verse 11 he says, "Have faith in me when I say that the Father is one with me and that I am one with the Father." Oneness signifies wholeness and completion
In verse 26 he promises, "But the Holy Spirit will come and help [d] you, because the Father will send the Spirit to take my place. The Spirit will teach you everything and will remind you of what I said while I was with you." hereby establishing the basis for the trinitarian doctrine.
Originally posted by robbie carrobie================================
oh jaywill my friend, i need to go out at present, when i return, we shall talk further, and if anyone needs mercy it is I, for a hopeless sinner is what I am, no doubt, but a trinitarian i am not, your sentiments are appreciated!
oh jaywill my friend, i need to go out at present, when i return, we shall talk further, and if anyone needs mercy it is I, for a hopeless sinner is what I am, no doubt, but a trinitarian i am not, your sentiments are appreciated!
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I do not ask that you say "I am a trinitarian". I only ask that you believe all of what the Scripture says about this Jesus Christ. He is God incarnate. And the Holy Spirit is also God.
When you return I would like to explain WHAT Christians mean when they call one another "brothers" according to the Word of God.
Originally posted by robbie carrobiethat fact that we are all sinners and in need of love and forgiveness is one thing we agree on... yes?
oh jaywill my friend, i need to go out at present, when i return, we shall talk further, and if anyone needs mercy it is I, for a hopeless sinner is what I am, no doubt, but a trinitarian i am not, your sentiments are appreciated!
Originally posted by robbie carrobieDo you have the assurance that you have been forgiven?
yes, we agree can agree wholeheartedly on this 🙂
God forbid, if the roof were collapse upon your room right now, and you were to die, do you have the assurance that you would be with Christ, saved from eternal perdition ?
Originally posted by jaywilli really do not know, i have never really thought about it, i suppose that because we are all offspring of Adam, then in that sense we are literally brothers. i once saw an amazing tv programme on genetics, and the researches reckoned that they could trace female genetic traits back to a single female, is that not amazing? i wish i could remember what that programme was. also i think that perhaps you have a spiritual meaning for this term?
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oh jaywill my friend, i need to go out at present, when i return, we shall talk further, and if anyone needs mercy it is I, for a hopeless sinner is what I am, no doubt, but a trinitarian i am not, your sentiments are appreciated!
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I do not ask that you say "I am a t ...[text shortened]... T Christians mean when they call one another "brothers" according to the Word of God.[/b]
Originally posted by jaywillNo, I entertain a hope, that i may be saved from perdition and to stand before God on the basis of Christ sin atoning sacrifice, on which i have put faith, for the forgiveness of sins, but i am not that great a human being, so its fifty fifty. but that being said, god is merciful, slow to anger and abundant in loving kindness, but i can honestly say Jaywill, i am not good company for the Christ.
Do you have the assurance that you have been forgiven?
God forbid, if the roof were collapse upon your room right now, and you were to die, do you have the assurance that you would be with Christ, saved from eternal perdition ?
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI will try in a minute to explain.
i really do not know, i have never really thought about it, i suppose that because we are all offspring of Adam, then in that sense we are literally brothers. i once saw an amazing tv programme on genetics, and the researches reckoned that they could trace female genetic traits back to a single female, is that not amazing? i wish i could remember what that programme was. also i think that perhaps you have a spiritual meaning for this term?
It is related to my other question about your assurance of salvation.
Originally posted by robbie carrobie======================================
No, I entertain a hope, that i may be saved from perdition and to stand before God on the basis of Christ sin atoning sacrifice, on which i have put faith, for the forgiveness of sins, but i am not that great a human being, so its fifty fifty.
No, I entertain a hope, that i may be saved from perdition and to stand before God on the basis of Christ sin atoning sacrifice, on which i have put faith, for the forgiveness of sins, but i am not that great a human being, so its fifty fifty.
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You should have the assurance of your salvation. This is one of the first things we try to help people to have when they believe in Christ.
You apparantly believe something about Christ. Why do you not have the assurance of your forgiveness?
I think I know why. Do you want to hear why I think you are yet in doubt about this ?
Originally posted by jaywillsure you can be my guest.
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No, I entertain a hope, that i may be saved from perdition and to stand before God on the basis of Christ sin atoning sacrifice, on which i have put faith, for the forgiveness of sins, but i am not that great a human being, so its fifty fifty.
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You should ...[text shortened]... eness?
I think I know why. Do you want to hear why I think you are yet in doubt about this ?[/b]
Originally posted by robbie carrobieRobbie, I don't think you have ever received Jesus into your heart as Lord and Savior. I think you have some extremly strong ideas about theology, well researched. You are able to debate your theological position with enthusiasm.
sure you can be my guest.
But I wonder that you have ever asked Jesus to come into your heart that you may be forgiven. You seem to be just hoping for the best. But John wrote:
"I have written these things to you that you may KNOW that you have eternal life, to you who believe into the name of the Son of God." (1 John 5:13)
The Bible said that you may KNOW. It did not say that you may hope for the best, assume, hang in there and see how it turns out, etc.
The Bible says you can KNOW that you have eternal life Robbie.
Do you believe that Jesus Christ is your Savior and Lord ? Did you ever ASK Jesus to come into your heart ?
Originally posted by jaywillits not that Jaywill my friend, its just that, well i speak on this matter tomorrow, its real late, i need to put my kid to bed and its been a long day.
Robbie, I don't think you have ever received Jesus into your heart as Lord and Savior. I think you have some extremly strong ideas about theology, well researched. You are able to debate your theological position with enthusiasm.
But I wonder that you have ever [b]asked Jesus to come into your heart that you may be forgiven. You seem to be just hopin ...[text shortened]... esus Christ is your Savior and Lord ? Did you ever ASK Jesus to come into your heart ?[/b]
Originally posted by jaywillThe Bible said that you may KNOW. It did not say that you may hope for the best, assume, hang in there and see how it turns out, etc.
Robbie, I don't think you have ever received Jesus into your heart as Lord and Savior. I think you have some extremly strong ideas about theology, well researched. You are able to debate your theological position with enthusiasm.
But I wonder that you have ever [b]asked Jesus to come into your heart that you may be forgiven. You seem to be just hopin ...[text shortened]... esus Christ is your Savior and Lord ? Did you ever ASK Jesus to come into your heart ?[/b]
Amen!