Without faith it is impossible to please God ..

Originally posted by apathist
I think an all-powerful god that wants us to worship it would not be a mystery. If you want a grip, back up a step first.

Why would you think that? You believe He would force us too or something? What if God
wanted something real between us and Him, something that force would break or ruin?

Originally posted by BigDoggProblem
Yes.

Since you know less that a billionth of 1% of everything there is to know, are you open to the possibility that your conclusion may be wrong or based upon insufficient data?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Since you know less that a billionth of 1% of everything there is to know, are you open to the possibility that your conclusion may be wrong or based upon insufficient data?

Same question back at you.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
Same question back at you.

Gosh. How many times has he wheeled this one out and then refused to apply/address it to himself?

Originally posted by FMF
Gosh. How many times has he wheeled this one out and then refused to apply/address it to himself?

17.

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
Same question back at you.

From my perspective my beliefs are based upon evidence and personal experiences not on a lack of evidence.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
From my perspective my beliefs are based upon evidence and personal experiences not on a lack of evidence.

So are you open to the possibility that your beliefs may be wrong or based upon insufficient data?

Originally posted by FMF
So are you open to the possibility that your beliefs may be wrong or based upon insufficient data?

Well I don't claim to know that a negative is true. If I were to claim to know that there is no gold in China I would need a lot more knowledge than if I were to claim to know that there is gold in China. All I would need to know is the location of one spec of gold in China and my belief that there is gold in China would be justified. On the other hand if I were to claim that there is no gold in China I would need more knowledge than I think is possible to possess to make such a claim.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
From my perspective my beliefs are based upon evidence and personal experiences not on a lack of evidence.

Indeed, from your perspective.

In the great scheme of things, that's pretty meaningless and a billion miles from anything universal or absolute. You get that right?

Originally posted by Ghost of a Duke
Indeed, from your perspective.

In the great scheme of things, that's pretty meaningless and a billion miles from anything universal or absolute. You get that right?

Yes sure if I'm wrong, but not if my beliefs really are true. You get that right?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Well I don't claim to know that a negative is true. If I were to claim to know that there is no gold in China I would need a lot more knowledge than if I were to claim to know that there is gold in China. All I would need to know is the location of one spec of gold in China and my belief that there is gold in China would be justified. On the other hand i ...[text shortened]... d in China I would need more knowledge than I think is possible to possess to make such a claim.

The question was: are you open to the possibility that your beliefs may be wrong?

Originally posted by FMF
The question was: are you open to the possibility that your beliefs may be wrong?

My doubts take nothing away from my certainty because I believe I am as certain as I possibly can be, but of course doubts always arise at times.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Yes sure if I'm wrong, but not if my beliefs really are true. You get that right?

But you have to be wrong. As you have explained yourself, we only know a billionth of what there is to know. How could you possibly be right?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
My doubts take nothing away from my certainty because I believe I am as certain as I possibly can be, but of course doubts always arise at times.

OK. So - just like me in these matters - you are willing to admit you might be wrong. We have that much in common.

Originally posted by FMF
OK. So - just like me in these matters - you are willing to admit you might be wrong. We have that much in common.

According to FetchMyCoat we only know a billionth of what there is to know, meaning the odds of him being right are one in a billion.

Those odds are pretty bad by anyone's standards.