Women to remain silent?

This is not some obscure Old Testament scripture, but from Paul, the architect of Christianity, in the New Testament. Look closely at what Paul (if it was Paul) says here. He says women should be silent and he gives a reason why.

"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over the man, but to be in silence. For Adam was first formed, then Eve. And Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression" 1 Timothy 2:11-14.

He gives a reason why women are to learn in silence with all subjection, and to not teach or usurp authority of the man, and to be in silence.

It is because Adam (not Eve) was first formed, and Adam was not deceived, but the woman being deceived was in the transgression.

Originally posted by moon1969
This is not some obscure Old Testament scripture, but from Paul, the architect of Christianity, in the New Testament. Look closely at what Paul (if it was Paul) says here. He says women should be silent and he gives a reason why.

[quote]"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over t ...[text shortened]... rmed, and Adam was not deceived, but [b]the woman being deceived was in the transgression.[/b]

Now you need to view the link on my thread "A Woman's View Of The Garden of Eden" and see it from a woman's viewpoint.

The Instructor

Originally posted by RJHinds
Now you need to view the link on my thread "A Woman's View Of The Garden of Eden" and see it from a woman's viewpoint.

The Instructor

no thanks. it would just be from rjhinds' perspective. and i am still at work so i can't scramble my brain to see your point of view.

i still need it.

Originally posted by moon1969
This is not some obscure Old Testament scripture, but from Paul, the architect of Christianity, in the New Testament. Look closely at what Paul (if it was Paul) says here. He says women should be silent and he gives a reason why.

[quote]"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over t ...[text shortened]... rmed, and Adam was not deceived, but [b]the woman being deceived was in the transgression.[/b]

religion evolves (pun intended)


only the more fundamentalist zealots adhere to this view. and most of the time, the women are ok with that. it is becoming more and more difficult to opress a woman against her will.

Originally posted by moon1969
This is not some obscure Old Testament scripture, but from Paul, the architect of Christianity, in the New Testament. Look closely at what Paul (if it was Paul) says here. He says women should be silent and he gives a reason why.

[quote]"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over t ...[text shortened]... rmed, and Adam was not deceived, but [b]the woman being deceived was in the transgression.[/b]

Yes the woman was deceived, Adam wasn't and he still didn't stop it.
Kelly

Originally posted by KellyJay
Yes the woman was deceived, Adam wasn't and he still didn't stop it.
Kelly

adam was deceived. he is just as guilty as eve

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
adam was deceived. he is just as guilty as eve

Guilty of what?

Disobeying god?

Nobody has yet given me a convincing reason why doing whatever the bible god says is a good thing.


Even if the event was not complete fiction, neither did anything anyone should feel guilty about.

Originally posted by googlefudge
Guilty of what?

Disobeying god?

Nobody has yet given me a convincing reason why doing whatever the bible god says is a good thing.


Even if the event was not complete fiction, neither did anything anyone should feel guilty about.

wow you think that the highest ever recorded figures of Aids among homosexuals, or the highest ever recorded figures for divorce, or the 150,000 abortions that will happen by the end of the day is a good thing and has no bearing on seeking moral independence from God and establishing ones own morality as did Adam and Eve, no disrespect but i cannot respect that, the new morality is a failure.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
wow you think that the highest ever recorded figures of Aids among homosexuals, or the highest ever recorded figures for divorce, or the 150,000 abortions that will happen by the end of the day is a good thing and has no bearing on seeking moral independence from God and establishing ones own morality as did Adam and Eve, no disrespect but i cannot respect that, the new morality is a failure.

Of course I think it has nothing to do with seeking moral independence from god.

God doesn't exist.


I do think that there are awesome benefits to not being tied to the despicable and outdated 'morality' of the bible...
Not least of which being I have nothing compelling me to be a lying scumbag and raging homophobe...

All disrespect intended.

Originally posted by googlefudge
Of course I think it has nothing to do with seeking moral independence from god.

God doesn't exist.


I do think that there are awesome benefits to not being tied to the despicable and outdated 'morality' of the bible...
Not least of which being I have nothing compelling me to be a lying scumbag and raging homophobe...

All disrespect intended.

sorry dude you gotta provide evidence to get respect, you have provided no evidence that God doesn't exist, its a mere opinion, cannot respect that dude. So much bitterness, you got serious hate speech going on there, I cannot have any part of that either dude.

Originally posted by moon1969
This is not some obscure Old Testament scripture, but from Paul, the architect of Christianity, in the New Testament. Look closely at what Paul (if it was Paul) says here. He says women should be silent and he gives a reason why.

[quote]"Let the woman learn in silence with all subjection. But I suffer not a woman to teach, nor to usurp authority over t rmed, and Adam was not deceived, but [b]the woman being deceived was in the transgression.[/b]

A woman should learn in quietness and full submission. I do not permit a woman to teach or to assume authority over a man she must be quiet. 1 Tim 2:11

In regard to the expression “full submission” at 1 Timothy 2:11 (New International Version), Bible scholar W. E. Vine states: “The injunction is not directed towards a surrender of mind and conscience, or the abandonment of duty of private judgment; the phrase ‘with all subjection’ is a warning against the usurpation of authority, as, e.g., in the next verse.”

Originally posted by googlefudge
Guilty of what?

Disobeying god?

Nobody has yet given me a convincing reason why doing whatever the bible god says is a good thing.


Even if the event was not complete fiction, neither did anything anyone should feel guilty about.

i was arguing from their point of view. i don't like much the story of adam and eve. not much moral value. it is supposed to show the consequences of disobeying god, but to me it is similar to tricking a small child into misbehaving by putting temptation within his reach then go way way overboard with the punishment.




there is however another moral to the story if you allow for the existence of the "IT god" that used evolution as a more or less autonomous program to be run and tried to give hints to his work in the bible.

the story of eve becomes the descent of monkeys from the trees and gainining "knowledge". the warning of god that "if you eat from the tree of knowledge you will surely die" can be interpreted as "you will become aware of your mortality, of how little you know, of how little time you have". chimp become man would not longer be carefree and live life one moment at a time.

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
i was arguing from their point of view. i don't like much the story of adam and eve. not much moral value. it is supposed to show the consequences of disobeying god, but to me it is similar to tricking a small child into misbehaving by putting temptation within his reach then go way way overboard with the punishment.




there is however another moral ave". chimp become man would not longer be carefree and live life one moment at a time.

thats hilarious, respect dude, sooooo funny.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
wow you think that the highest ever recorded figures of Aids among homosexuals, or the highest ever recorded figures for divorce, or the 150,000 abortions that will happen by the end of the day is a good thing and has no bearing on seeking moral independence from God and establishing ones own morality as did Adam and Eve, no disrespect but i cannot respect that, the new morality is a failure.

do you believe that adam and eve fully knew what punishment was in store for them before they committed the sin?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
sorry dude you gotta provide evidence to get respect, you have provided no evidence that God doesn't exist, its a mere opinion, cannot respect that dude. So much bitterness, you got serious hate speech going on there, I cannot have any part of that either dude.

you have provided no evidence that God doesn't exist, its a mere opinion, cannot respect that

do you use this logic in all walks of life or just with god?