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Culture Forum

  1. Standard member Seitse
    Doug Stanhope
    06 Oct '08 13:22
    STOCKHOLM, Sweden - Bad news for American writers hoping for a Nobel Prize next week: The top member of the award jury believes the United States is too insular and ignorant to compete with Europe when it comes to great writing.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26960322/

    I invite you to read the whole story.

    I concur with Mr. Engdahl.
  2. 06 Oct '08 15:56
    Originally posted by Seitse
    [b]STOCKHOLM, Sweden - Bad news for American writers hoping for a Nobel Prize next week: The top member of the award jury believes the United States is too insular and ignorant to compete with Europe when it comes to great writing.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26960322/

    I invite you to read the whole story.

    I concur with Mr. Engdahl.[/b]
    Permanent secretary Horace Engdahl shows bad judgment for saying this publicly; obviously, he's become too jaded for his job on the Nobel board and should be replaced immediately.
  3. 06 Oct '08 16:00
    Originally posted by Seitse
    [b]STOCKHOLM, Sweden - Bad news for American writers hoping for a Nobel Prize next week: The top member of the award jury believes the United States is too insular and ignorant to compete with Europe when it comes to great writing.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26960322/

    I invite you to read the whole story.

    I concur with Mr. Engdahl.[/b]
    And another thing, why would anyone expect the United States to produce any great writers that would impress a politically correct, liberally-biased board such as the one that awards the Nobel Prize for Literature when way too many U.S. minority kids drop out of high school or graduate without learning to read or write, much less, appreciate literature?
  4. Standard member rbmorris
    Vampyroteuthis
    06 Oct '08 16:27
    Originally posted by Seitse
    [b]STOCKHOLM, Sweden - Bad news for American writers hoping for a Nobel Prize next week: The top member of the award jury believes the United States is too insular and ignorant to compete with Europe when it comes to great writing.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26960322/

    I invite you to read the whole story.

    I concur with Mr. Engdahl.[/b]
    I read the whole story. I can understand if the submissions were ignorant or insular, but to say that of a whole country (of over 300 million people) is stupid, ignorant and inexcusable--particularly from someone in his position.

    Seitse, it surprises me that you of all people would agree with this kind of closed-minded, xenophobic crap.
  5. Standard member Bosse de Nage
    Zellulärer Automat
    06 Oct '08 17:49 / 1 edit
    Which writers from North America (incl. Canada) would you nominate for the Nobel Prize?

    I'd say Ursula Le Guin is a thousand times more deserving of the honour than Doris bloody Lessing.
  6. 06 Oct '08 17:58
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Which writers from North America (incl. Canada) would you nominate for the Nobel Prize?

    I'd say Ursula Le Guin is a thousand times more deserving of the honour than Doris bloody Lessing.
    That's not the point -- it's in very bad taste for the judge to just come out and tell a whole country to not bother because you're too ignorant and insular.
  7. Standard member Bosse de Nage
    Zellulärer Automat
    06 Oct '08 18:03
    Originally posted by der schwarze Ritter
    That's not the point -- it's in very bad taste for the judge to just come out and tell a whole country to not bother because you're too ignorant and insular.
    OK, I condemn his narrow-mindedness. But I really couldn't care less.

    Now who'd you put up for a Nobel Prize? Margaret Atwood is also a worthy contender. Twice as deep as JM Coetzee and twenty times more readable.
  8. Standard member rbmorris
    Vampyroteuthis
    06 Oct '08 19:22 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Now who'd you put up for a Nobel Prize? Margaret Atwood is also a worthy contender. Twice as deep as JM Coetzee and twenty times more readable.
    I've read books by each author, but none of their more recent stuff, so I couldn't say. Anything particularly noteworthy?
  9. Standard member epiphinehas
    Luke 12:24
    07 Oct '08 01:53
    Originally posted by Seitse
    [b]STOCKHOLM, Sweden - Bad news for American writers hoping for a Nobel Prize next week: The top member of the award jury believes the United States is too insular and ignorant to compete with Europe when it comes to great writing.

    http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26960322/

    I invite you to read the whole story.

    I concur with Mr. Engdahl.[/b]
    Insular and ignorant?

    Sounds like another European who can only see George W. Bush's face when he thinks of America.

    America is a mind-bogglingly diverse cultural habitat separate from what one might find in our mass media pop culture. America has the best higher education system in the world and has no shortage of brilliant minds.

    I think the real problem has something to do with marketing.
  10. Standard member Seitse
    Doug Stanhope
    07 Oct '08 06:46 / 1 edit
    Rb, I apologize for surprising you.

    I am not agreeing with the fact that a member of the committee makes such a statement publicly.

    I agree on the fact that, besides DeLillo and a couple others (just a couple), the U.S. is not producing literary monsters like it used to.

    I agree on the fact that the U.S. is so concentrated on its own bellybutton (politically, socially, culturally, etc.) that the writers reflect that, impacting their quality or, if not the quality, at least the possibility of their work to be read and ejoyed by the rest of the world. e.g. their writers have become less universal. For example, everybody was thrilled to read Hemingway because, besides the quality of the prose, he wrote about an American in the Spanish Civil War, for example.

    Today, it is too much about what the market wants, and currently the market wants the 7 habits of the extra extraordinary extraordinarity, or Rich dad/poor dad, or colored parachutes, or something for readers like DSR who immediately attacks persons instead of arguments or blames the foreigners, and stuff like that.

    Europe is writing about the universal issues of human existence... what is the U.S. writing about?
  11. Standard member Seitse
    Doug Stanhope
    07 Oct '08 06:52 / 1 edit
    This is about literature, but perhaps this demonstrates how concentrated in themselves some Americans are:

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/11/26/world/main530872.shtml

    It is a misconception that the U.S. education system kicks ass. All the following countries' education systems are ranked ahead of the U.S.

    1. South Korea
    2. Japan
    3. Finland (hurra!)
    4. Canada
    5. Australia
    6. Austria
    7. Britain
    8. Ireland
    9. Sweden
    10. Czech Republic
    - (tie) New Zealand
    12. France
    13. Switzerland
    14. Belgium
    - (tie) Iceland
    16. Hungary
    - (tie) Norway

    A question for epiph + rb... would you consider yourselves, culture-wise, representatives of the majority of Americans?
  12. Standard member Bosse de Nage
    Zellulärer Automat
    07 Oct '08 07:00
    Originally posted by rbmorris
    I've read books by each author, but none of their more recent stuff, so I couldn't say. Anything particularly noteworthy?
    Oryx & Crake, for Atwood. Lavinia, for Le Guin.
  13. Standard member Seitse
    Doug Stanhope
    07 Oct '08 07:18 / 1 edit
    Originally posted by Bosse de Nage
    Oryx & Crake, for Atwood. Lavinia, for Le Guin.
    Isn't Atwood Canadian?

    I heard about her thanks to the 'Principe de Asturias' for Literature she won.

    http://www.fundacionprincipedeasturias.org/esp/04/generados/galardonados2008_8.html
  14. Standard member epiphinehas
    Luke 12:24
    07 Oct '08 07:29
    Originally posted by Seitse
    This is about literature, but perhaps this demonstrates how concentrated in themselves some Americans are:

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2002/11/26/world/main530872.shtml

    It is a misconception that the U.S. education system kicks ass. All the following countries' education systems are ranked ahead of the U.S.

    1. South Korea
    2. Japan
    3. Finland ([b ...[text shortened]... b... would you consider yourselves, culture-wise, representatives of the majority of Americans?
    A question for epiph + rb... would you consider yourselves, culture-wise, representatives of the majority of Americans?

    Why do you insist on generalizations?
  15. Standard member Bosse de Nage
    Zellulärer Automat
    07 Oct '08 07:35
    Maybe this thread could be turned to focus on American writers, if there are any Americans here interested in talking about American writers ...