@shavixmir saidNetanyhu never sent in troops into Gaza to rape, kill and take hostages.
They elected Netenyahoo… who was known to be a fascist, nazi bully boy.
@Rajk999 said... And it just ends at no point, right, because something like 1,100 Israelis died in al-Aqsa flood, a bit less than half were civilians. Yet, we have tens of thousands of dead Palestinians, and if we count those who die from lack of medical care or from malnutrition, the number would be in the hundreds of thousands.
I am saying that I am a supporter of responding in kind.
You attack and kill my civilians.
I will attack and kill yours.
If you ignore the Geneva Convention rules of war.
I will do likewise.
In the case of terrorists, the whole family is going to die.
Terrorists target, rape and kill entire families.
Their killing is indiscriminate, so they will receive similar tre ...[text shortened]... ment.
One side cannot be bound by the Geneva Convention, while the other is not.
Its ridiculous.
All for what?
And perhaps even more important is the idea that the Palestinian cause is absolutely justified. They are simply trying to live on the land that they have lived on for a thousand years, and it is the Jews who have come from across the sea and gotten into airplanes to show up and attack & remove them, taking all of it for t hemselves minus a token minority of Arabs among them that are second-class citizens.
@Philokalia saidYou are presenting the history of Palestine in a very irresponsible manner. If you want a response then please stick to verifiable and factual historical records instead of emotional ranting.
... And it just ends at no point, right, because something like 1,100 Israelis died in al-Aqsa flood, a bit less than half were civilians. Yet, we have tens of thousands of dead Palestinians, and if we count those who die from lack of medical care or from malnutrition, the number would be in the hundreds of thousands.
All for what?
And perhaps even more important i ...[text shortened]... all of it for t hemselves minus a token minority of Arabs among them that are second-class citizens.
As for this current war, I suspect it will end soon.
@Rajk999 saidThe history is rather simple. The Hebrews were displaced by the Romans.
You are presenting the history of Palestine in a very irresponsible manner. If you want a response then please stick to verifiable and factual historical records instead of emotional ranting.
As for this current war, I suspect it will end soon.
Subsequently, Jewish peoples from around the world were spread out throughout the world. But this was already the case - during the Babylonian Captivity, not every Jew made it to Babylon. Many fled across Egypt and spread throughout North Africa. The Carthage area had a large amount of Jews living there.
Carthage, of course, is also eventually defeated by the Romans.
There is a period, then, where the Jews were zealous in converting others. The Carthaginians were descendants of the Phoenicians, who were basically a sort of Canaanite, and so they sp oke a language not dissimilar to Hebrew. It was easy to find many North African / Carthaginian converts to Judaism for the Jews because of the fact that they felt their gods had failed them against the Romans and, of course, because the Jewish religion is exponentially superior to the violent polytheism of the Carthaginians.
Some amount of the Jews returned to Jerusalem to rebuild and create the Second Temple. Intermarriage with non-Jews was so common that, in the book of Ezra 10, we read this:
2 Then Shecaniah son of Jehiel, an Elamite, responded to Ezra: “We have been unfaithful to our God by marrying foreign women from the surrounding peoples, but there is still hope for Israel in spite of this. 3 Let us therefore make a covenant before our God to send away all the foreign wives and their children, according to the counsel of my lord and of those who tremble at the command of our God. Let it be done according to the law. 4 Get up, for this matter is your responsibility, and we support you. Be strong and take action!”
...
2 Then Shecaniah son of Jehiel, an Elamite, responded to Ezra: “We have been unfaithful to our God by marrying foreign women from the surrounding peoples, but there is still hope for Israel in spite of this. 3 Let us therefore make a covenant before our God to send away all the foreign wives and their children, according to the counsel of my lord and of those who tremble at the command of our God. Let it be done according to the law. 4 Get up, for this matter is your responsibility, and we support you. Be strong and take action!”
12 Then all the assembly responded with a loud voice: “Yes, we will do as you say! 13 But there are many people, and it is the rainy season. We don’t have the stamina to stay out in the open. This isn’t something that can be done in a day or two, for we have rebelled terribly in this matter. 14 Let our leaders represent the entire assembly. Then let all those in our towns who have married foreign women come at appointed times, together with the elders and judges of each town, in order to avert the fierce anger of our God concerning[c] this matter.” 15 Only Jonathan son of Asahel and Jahzeiah son of Tikvah opposed this, with Meshullam and Shabbethai the Levite supporting them.
16 The exiles did what had been proposed. Ezra the priest selected men[d] who were family leaders, all identified by name, to represent[e] their ancestral houses. They convened on the first day of the tenth month to investigate the matter, 17 and by the first day of the first month they had dealt with all the men who had married foreign women.
So we can imagine that Jews prior to this were marrying foreign women, and the Jews who did not return from the Babylonian exile were also marrying foreign women...
We are also aware that John Hyrcanus forcefully converted the Edomites to Judaism in the 2nd century BC.
Jews also converted many people throughout the Mediterranean world. Again, because their religion was quite enlightened. By the first century AD, 2 to 7 million Jews lived in the Roman Empire, making them potentially up to even up to 5-7% of the Roman Empire at that time. There were probably 40 to 60 thousand Jews in Rome itself in the 1st century AD...
I think it is the case that the Jews had become a very cosmopolitan people, right, so what does it even mean when we suggest that the Jews are exclusively a people of Palestine..? That that land is all theirs..?
That... 2,000 years after all this, some blond haired guy from Brooklyn has a right to be in the West Bank displaying a Palestinian family?
Genetically modern Palestinians are closer to the ancient population that lived there than the Jews.
Is this some unfair understanding of the history?
@Philokalia saidAnything older than 100 years is ancient history, so Im not interested. About 100 years ago the British took Palestine from the Ottoman Empire. They were the new colonial power and had full control of Palestine, and by the customs at that time the colonial power owned the region. Palestine was then a British colony.
Is this some unfair understanding of the history?
Start there if you like.
@Rajk999 saidOK, so it is good for the existing colonial power to create a project where it creates a Jewish ethnostate on top of a Muslim majority population?
Anything older than 100 years is ancient history, so Im not interested. About 100 years ago the British took Palestine from the Ottoman Empire. They were the new colonial power and had full control of Palestine, and by the customs at that time the colonial power owned the region. Palestine was then a British colony.
Start there if you like.
@Philokalia saidYes it was. Between 1915 and 1945, those 30 years the British developed the infrastructue of Palestine which was primitive. The Jews assisted the British with electricity and water distribution and played a major role in Palestine's development, while the indigenous Arabs resisted and hindered development. They are a backward people whose aim was to disrupt any progress of the Jewish state. So in 1948, with the approval of the UN, the Partition Plan was implemented. The British proposed a 53/47 split in favour of Israel, but with lots of desert allocated to them. They Jews made great progress while the Arabs were consumed by hatred and their sole aim was to kill Jews. Needless to say they failed miserably.
OK, so it is good for the existing colonial power to create a project where it creates a Jewish ethnostate on top of a Muslim majority population?
@Rajk999 saidYou are basically saying that the colonial Jews who acted as middlemen and were starting their own ethnostate project have a right to displace the indigenous people because you view them as having been uncooperative and backwards.
Yes it was. Between 1915 and 1945, those 30 years the British developed the infrastructue of Palestine which was primitive. The Jews assisted the British with electricity and water distribution and played a major role in Palestine's development, while the indigenous Arabs resisted and hindered development. They are a backward people whose aim was to disrupt any progress of ...[text shortened]... were consumed by hatred and their sole aim was to kill Jews. Needless to say they failed miserably.
You are basically just saying, Jews are better than Arabs. Their lifestyle reflects my own the most, and so they are entitled to take the land even if they weren't natives.
Do the Chinese get to kick you off of your land one day because you live in a comparatively backwards culture?
Do whites get to displace blacks in downtown Chicago or LA because their lifestyle is more conducive to civilization?
Neither might nor efficiency makes right.
@Philokalia saidHamas killed Jewish women and children. Then ran back into Gaza to hide behind their women and children, who were used as human shields. I thought we been through that already.
If the Jews are so wonderful & so great at building a society, why do they have to reduce to killing women & children to do so?
@Philokalia saidThe Jews bought land in Palestine. After the partition in 1948, both Jews and Arabs would have been displaced. The colonial owners, the British have the right to partition the land so that each group can live separately. From 1915 when the British moved in, it was clear that these two groups could not live in peace and needed to be separate.
You are basically saying that the colonial Jews who acted as middlemen and were starting their own ethnostate project have a right to displace the indigenous people because you view them as having been uncooperative and backwards.
You are basically just saying, [i]Jews are better than Arabs. Their lifestyle reflects my own the most, and so they are entitled to take the ...[text shortened]... ause their lifestyle is more conducive to civilization?
Neither might nor efficiency makes right.
The Colonial era is over. The right to self determination was established by the UN sometime in the 1960s and all nations signed and ratified this agreement. Since then the British, French, Spanish Dutch etc, all left their respective colonies to manage their own affairs.
@Rajk999 saidThe Geneva conventions don't "bind" because they do not cause weakness or disadvantage to the side that follows them.
I am saying that I am a supporter of responding in kind.
You attack and kill my civilians.
I will attack and kill yours.
If you ignore the Geneva Convention rules of war.
I will do likewise.
In the case of terrorists, the whole family is going to die.
Terrorists target, rape and kill entire families.
Their killing is indiscriminate, so they will receive similar tre ...[text shortened]... ment.
One side cannot be bound by the Geneva Convention, while the other is not.
Its ridiculous.