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Originally posted by SeitseI'm right on the border with it and the levels of crime in LA are ridiculous. It's pissing me off. The fact that my police can't chase people down over there means we need to control entry more carefully. Over half of the 18th Street gangsters in the city are illegal immigrants. The Avenues pulled an AK47 on LAPD right when I moved back into the neighborhood they claim as their own. I'm tired of this BS.
What's with the obsession with Mexico, amigo?
Originally posted by AThousandYoungLook, using Mexico and Mexicans as scapegoat is what your leaders want you to believe. The empires have done it for centuries, feeding to their sheep... er, sorry... citizens, the idea that there is this big bad wolf out there.
I'm right on the border with it and the levels of crime in LA are ridiculous. It's pissing me off. The fact that my police can't chase people down over there means we need to control entry more carefully. Over half of the 18th Street gangsters in the city are illegal immigrants. The Avenues pulled an AK47 on LAPD right when I moved back into the neighborhood they claim as their own. I'm tired of this BS.
This strategy works because: (a) it clears them from the responsibility of their own flaws as leaders, and (b) it softens the citizens, who give their liberties away because they are afraid.
It's so obvious: the English first, then the black population, then the Soviet Empire, then the drug cartels, the Irakis, the Mexicans, the Afghans, Al Qaeida, etc. etc.
Isn't it obvious?
The question is: When are you going to stop being fooled by your own government, and you will start demanding from them: honesty, better schools, support for entrepreneurs etc.?
And if they tell you there is no money, you can tell them the truth: Stop giving my money to the big corps led by your buddies, and put it in more schools and hospitals.
Period.
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Originally posted by SeitseOh, I'm sorry, there are no Mexicans in the LA gangs, glad you cleared that up. It's all a California Department of Justice conspiracy.
Look, using Mexico and Mexicans as [b]scapegoat is what your leaders want you to believe. The empires have done it for centuries, feeding to their sheep... er, sorry... citizens, the idea that there is this big bad wolf out there.
This strategy works because: (a) it clears them from the responsibility of their own flaws as leaders, and (b) ey to the big corps led by your buddies, and put it in more schools and hospitals.
Period.[/b]
In fact, the so called "Latino gangs" are really a rainbow coalition of American citizens with no ties to Mexico. The fact that the Mexican Army's occupying TJ hunting gangsters and disarming the police is a mere coincidence.
My cousin, in prison for murder in the name of 18th Street, is really a Hasidic Jew. He pretends to be chicano, but he's really a Jew.
My father's illegal immigrant employees get their cocaine from England I'm sure. And the Avenues? The "Avenues" in question aren't the ones I live near; no, it's a Bangladesh word meaning "love and flowers".
Right, Seitse?
Oh, look here, the Jews from 18th Street made it all the way to El Salvador. Amazing for a group with no ties to Mexico!
http://www.pbs.org/wnet/wideangle/shows/elsalvador/index.html
Originally posted by AThousandYoungOh yes, I forgot, the simplistic argument.
Oh, I'm sorry, there are no Mexicans in the LA gangs, glad you cleared that up. It's all a California Department of Justice conspiracy.
In fact, the so called "Latino gangs" are really a rainbow coalition of American citizens with no ties to Mexico. The fact that the Mexican Army's occupying TJ hunting gangsters and disarming the police is a mere ...[text shortened]... ive near; no, it's a Bangladesh word meaning "love and flowers".
Right, Seitse?
Let's talk about the Chinese, Japanese, Guatemalan, Ecuatorian, Eastern European, white Americans, Russian, Greek, Brazilian, and African people in U.S. gangs as well. Agreed?
You totally missed the point, and of course you are looking only at tags.
The establishment has won your mind. They won. You are their puppet now.
Everything is o.k. with your country. It's all the foreigners' fault. Right?
🙂
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Originally posted by SeitseLet's talk about the Chinese, Japanese, Guatemalan, Ecuatorian, Eastern European, white Americans, Russian, Greek, Brazilian, and African people in U.S. gangs as well. Agreed?
Oh yes, I forgot, the simplistic argument.
Let's talk about the Chinese, Japanese, Guatemalan, Ecuatorian, Eastern European, white Americans, Russian, Greek, Brazilian, and African people in U.S. gangs as well. Agreed?
You totally missed the point, and of course you are looking only at tags.
The establishment has won your mind. They won. You are thei ...[text shortened]... et now.
Everything is o.k. with your country. It's all the foreigners' fault. Right?
🙂
Where? I never see them. I see Latinos and blacks in gangs mostly. Once in a while a guy with a swastica tattoo. Armenians can get pretty ghetto, but I don't see them with gang tattoos on their heads.
Where are these people? When's the last time any of them have pulled an assault rifle on the police? Give me some examples, please, because I don't see them on the streets.
Besides, those borders ARE controlled. You can't just walk here from Japan.
It's not all the foreigners' fault, but you can't take care of business at home when the thugs can just walk out of the country and come back with reinforcements when it's convenient.
Originally posted by AThousandYoungIt's NOT the foreigners fault at all.
It's not all the foreigners' fault, but you can't take care of business at home when the thugs can just walk out of the country and come back with reinforcements when it's convenient.
The reason why so many people want to go to the U.S. whatever it takes, and why so many people do not have respect for the country, and why so many people pursue earnings no matter what they do, and the reason why things go the way they go in the U.S. is entirely the U.S.
Your government should stop spending in many "useless things" (for the plain citizen like you, at least) and spend on education, education, education, anticorruption measures, healthcare, and development
The whole point is: Will you keep looking beyond the border to find guilty people, or will you start looking at the White House and demand that they work for YOU and not for their own pockets and for Halliburton et.al.?
Originally posted by SeitseWhy don't you believe in personal accountability? With your limp excuses for illegal immigration, you're nothing more than a two-bit race hustler, no better than Jesse Jackson or Al Sharpton.
It's NOT the foreigners fault at [b]all.
The reason why so many people want to go to the U.S. whatever it takes, and why so many people do not have respect for the country, and why so many people pursue earnings no matter what they do, and the reason why things go the way they go in the U.S. is entirely the U.S.
Your government should stop spending ...[text shortened]... d demand that they work for YOU and not for their own pockets and for Halliburton et.al.?[/i][/b]
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Originally posted by SeitseBeyond the border? THEY'RE IN UNIFORM ON THE STREETS OF MY NEIGHBORHOOD!
It's NOT the foreigners fault at [b]all.
The reason why so many people want to go to the U.S. whatever it takes, and why so many people do not have respect for the country, and why so many people pursue earnings no matter what they do, and the reason why things go the way they go in the U.S. is entirely the U.S.
Your government should stop spending d demand that they work for YOU and not for their own pockets and for Halliburton et.al.?[/i][/b]
That is, they were until they decided to challenge the LAPD and got their butts beat.
I can't believe you're claiming Mexican criminals are not responsible for their crimes...that's it's Bush's fault that Mexicans commit crimes on the streets of LA (and not in the sense of "he's not protecting America" but in the sense of "he made them do it and needs to be nicer to them"!?).
Even Mexico's hunting these dirtbags down. Why are you supporing these North American transnational street gangs? The US opposes them. Mexico opposes them. Why do you support them? Why do you defend them?
I am not bashing Mexico here, if you'll notice. Are you confusing my desire to fence the border with hatred for Mexico? That's not it at all. I hate the criminals that hop back and forth between the two countries. I certainly hope you don't think Mexico is nothing more than the thugs shooting people on the streets of LA. I'd think you'd know better than that.
Originally posted by AThousandYoungMexican criminals not responsible?
Beyond the border? THEY'RE IN UNIFORM ON THE STREETS OF MY NEIGHBORHOOD!
That is, they were until they decided to challenge the LAPD and got their butts beat.
I can't believe you're claiming Mexican criminals are not responsible for their crimes...that's it's Bush's fault that Mexicans commit crimes on the streets of LA (and not in the sense of ...[text shortened]... s shooting people on the streets of LA. I'd think you'd know better than that.
Each and every person with a criminal activity is responsible, whatever the person's citizenship or race. If a Mexican or a Chinese or a Russian or an American pull out the AK-47 and gun someone down, that person is guilty as charged and should go to San Quintin (is it still operational? 😕 ).
The issue is not that, dude, the issue is: Why is the U.S. and your neighborhood so dangerous?
There is where I refuse to accept: "it's the Mexicans' fault" or "it's the Russian mafia's fault" or "it's Al Qaida's fault" or "it's Gorvachev's fault" or "it's the Iranians fault" or whatever individualization.
That's called scapegoat and it is what they want you to believe.
My argument is that the problems are structural, and have to do with what the U.S. government does or what it does not do, with a shared responsibility with the U.S. population, who allows them (due to their apathy) to be sipping martinis in their Washington offices instead of working to improve your life and the life of your neighbor.
I don't know if the above explains it better?
My message here is: Stop blaming it on the individuals, and focus your pressure (and please do pressure) on the government of your country. Ask them to:
- invest in education
- invest in supporting community social, cultural, environmental and economic development
- invest in campaigns against drug consumption
- invest in making the poor neighborhoods a place of opportunities and not of despair
- invest in fighting corruption at ALL levels of government
- and even: invest in more cops and in a higher fence with Mexico, if you wish.
Where is that money coming from? Well, let me assure you that the U.S. spends in a lot of crap that ends in the pockets of Cheneys, Bushes, and others we do not even know their name, instead of investing it in your neighborhood.
Bottom line: L.A. and many other places are dangerous not because of the Mexicans, but because your government does not do something effective to change the structural problems.
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Originally posted by SeitseEach and every person with a criminal activity is responsible, whatever the person's citizenship or race.
Mexican criminals not responsible?
Each and every person with a criminal activity is responsible, whatever the person's citizenship or race. If a Mexican or a Chinese or a Russian or an American pull out the AK-47 and gun someone down, that person is guilty as charged and should go to San Quintin (is it still operational? 😕 ).
The issue is not that, du does not do something effective to change the [b]structural problems.[/b]
You reject individualization, but this is a world full of individuals. Crimes are committed by individuals, sometimes working with other individuals.
Why is the U.S. and your neighborhood so dangerous?
Because we have a lot of thugs here attacking people. Isn't it obvious?
They are either individuals or an imaginary conspiracy theory. In either case they are a scapegoat that can't even be named and challenged because it's deliberately described with the mysterious term they.
My message here is: Stop blaming it on the individuals, and focus your pressure (and please [b]do pressure) on the government of your country.[/b]
You mean on the individual representatives? Or do you mean I should pressure the Constitution? Or is it the White House I should pressure? Maybe the flag?
Our representatives are already taking tons of money out of California in order to fund the rest of the nation. Why don't I pressure them to stop doing that so we can deal with our crime problems? Maybe if we weren't subsidizing people in Red America we'd be able to afford to open a few more schools.
LA is not dangerous because of our government. You've already pointed out who's responsible for the danger.
Each and every person with a criminal activity is responsible, whatever the person's citizenship or race.
Originally posted by AThousandYoung''because we have a lot of thugs''
[b]Each and every person with a criminal activity is responsible, whatever the person's citizenship or race.
You reject individualization, but this is a world full of individuals. Crimes are committed by individuals, sometimes working with other individuals.
Why is the U.S. and your neighborhood so dangerous?
Because we have a lot ...[text shortened]... ith a criminal activity is responsible, whatever the person's citizenship or race.[/i][/b]
Dude, I've read daring, smart, funny, challenging and worth post by you. This -one, however, it's the most simplistic and stupid.
Crime has reasons behind it and those are the ones I've been trying to debate with you. Criminals don't just blossom like flowers. There are reasons behind, and my bet is that your government doesn't spend in you. No conspiracy theories here not evil speedy\gonzalez smugglimg AKs and hash into your hood.
Originally posted by surtismAbout 12 miles from where I live is a great town that is being rapidly destroyed by crime and drug gangs like the "Bloods".A town that only a few years ago,you could walk the streets anytime of day and not be robbed or murdered.last month for example,there was 5 murders.The gangs are causing normal people to move out,business to close,job loss and more.Vigilantism?National guard,buring down certain areas of the town where these gangs are known to hide out....YES...to all of thses things!Years ago,there was alot of problems with the "MOVE"...a group of minority people living in Philadelphia,Pa.they were ruining that part of the city.So the POLICE burned down the whole block!YES!Oh,there was alot of jail time for some police and investigations,but it was worth it!Now,no more "MOVE" and the city while not perfect,is much better!These punks must learn...force against force.They cannot prevail forever!The law sometimes must be bent alittle to accomodate a war against gangs.Hey,our CIA does it all the time killing enemies against the US and its allies with snipers and more,and they are NOT following the "laws"as defined under international law.
This is a serious question, what is happening in the streets of the UK? The youth are running riot, knife and gun crime is on the increase, rape and sexual assaults abound and the hands of the police are tied, if they try to crack down on crime then they get attacked by gangs as in Manchester last week. If they do manage to arrest somebody then they cannot ...[text shortened]... t up with this?
Just some gentle dinner debate from tonight, any thoughts????
Stay safe!