Originally posted by whodeyYep. Organized gangs fighting over the government enforced monopoly on drugs.
And what are the majority of crimes in LA related to? Are they not related to gangs? I think organized crime on average tends to be much more violent in nature than people going it alone, but I may be wrong about that. It's just a guess.
I heard that the worst gangs and most violent gangs are coming from Mexico and into the states. From what I hear the ...[text shortened]... ople. It would then stand to reason that these groups must be targeted in some way or another.
I agree about the lack of border security being very helpful for the gangs.
Therefore, I would have to conclude that much of this violence is simply fostered by various groups and passed down to various people. It would then stand to reason that these groups must be targeted in some way or another.
Maybe. We have a New York import for a police chief now, and I think he's doing an excellent job, possibly because of his organized crime experience (assuming he had some, he's a New York cop after all).
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Originally posted by SeitseI don't know. They certainly aren't enough by themselves. I think even if they are part of the solution, a bigger part of the solution is (as with any of the zillions of other 'plausible solutions'😉 is - how do you get these things applied to everyone everywhere? Redistribution retards economic growth. What's an 'honest government' and how do you get one? How do you get equally high quality teachers into CRIP-land where I work, down the street from where Rodney King was beaten and where the residents torched the surrounding areas, as you get in Palos Verdes, where it's beautiful and safe, and where the money will tend to gravitate because of the beauty and safety?
Do you disagree with my answer?
So education, honest government, and economic growth are not the solutions for crime?
And, since I think you disapprove of a closed border, how do Americans get them into Mexico, since we can't keep out the Mexican criminals?
Originally posted by AThousandYoungThe U.S. would have crime with or without Mexicans. Unless you accept that, it's impossible to discuss. A scapgoat is always a hinder for debating.
I don't know. They certainly aren't enough by themselves. I think even if they are part of the solution, a bigger part of the solution is (as with any of the zillions of other 'plausible solutions'😉 is - how do you get these things applied to everyone everywhere? Redistribution retards economic growth. What's an 'honest government' and how do you ...[text shortened]... , how do Americans get them into Mexico, since we can't keep out the Mexican criminals?
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Originally posted by SeitseYou have the answer. Why hasn't it been implemented? Are you like God, who can do it, but won't for some unfathomable reason of your own?
The U.S. would have crime with or without Mexicans. Unless you accept that, it's impossible to discuss. A scapgoat is always a hinder for debating.
Or are you full of crap when you claim to know the answer?
Here's another answer that's just as good as yours, Seitse. If everyone accepted Jesus Christ as interpreted by the Roman Catholic Church, there would be no more violence.
Or...if everyone embraced Marxism, there would be no more violence.
Good luck implementing either of those either. People have been trying for a long, long time.
Armchair solutions to the problems of the world don't work unless you can implement them, and that's where it all breaks apart. Implementation is the hard part.
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Originally posted by zakkwylderI didn't condemn anyone. I simply pointed out that any education we put in place in the US would not solve Mexico's problems, and with an open border, those problems wander over here. Thus, policies in the US won't solve the problem.
With a generalized exception to major cities, the U.S. economy depends on the illegal mexican workforce, predominantly in the southwest. Amazing how a country condemns a people that they rely on. Sounds an awful lot like Nazi germany to me.
We're talking about solving the violence problem. Violent people come to the US from Mexico (and yes, there are also violent people already here, and violent Americans who go to other places). Therefore violence in the US cannot be solved by Americans without either a fence or the annexation of Mexico.
Let's switch things up. Can Mexico realistically stop violence in Mexico without addressing violent American criminals who hop over the border at will? Will Mexican schools solve the problems in the inner cities of the US?
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Originally posted by AThousandYoungNo, dude, you are very wrong. Accepting Jesus is not a guarantee of no violence, since it is in the Bible that the world will live times of blood and suffering. Read some Bible, man.
You have the answer. Why hasn't it been implemented? Are you like God, who can do it, but won't for some unfathomable reason of your own?
Or are you full of crap when you claim to know the answer?
Here's another answer that's just as good as yours, Seitse. If everyone accepted Jesus Christ as interpreted by the Roman Catholic Church, there wou an implement them, and that's where it all breaks apart. Implementation is the hard part.
Now, your arrogant and insulting tone when writing only demonstrates how ignorant you are.
The solutions I provided ARE solutions. But their implementation is difficult because homo homini lupus. However, societies have achieved it throughout history and that demonstrates that it is possible.
And if you don't speak Latin, then learn some. After you do, you reply to this post, understood?
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Originally posted by SeitseThat's because the Bible acknowledges that not everyone will absolutely, faithfully follow the same Church. The Bible knows better than you; this is a problem that cannot be solved.
No, dude, you are very wrong. Accepting Jesus is not a guarantee of no violence, since it is in the Bible that the world will live times of blood and suffering. Read some Bible, man.
Now, your arrogant and insulting tone when writing only demonstrates how ignorant you are.
The solutions I provided ARE solutions. But their [b]implementation is diffic ...[text shortened]... nd if you don't speak Latin, then learn some. After you do, you reply to this post, understood?[/b]
A "solution" that cannot be implemented is no solution at all.
However, societies have achieved it throughout history and that demonstrates that it is possible.
Please, elaborate.
Here's another one: if everyone stopped being violent, there would be no more violence.
Yay! I found the solution to violence!
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Originally posted by AThousandYoung[/b]Wait, wait, wait... do you really believe that violence can be eradicated completely from the face of the earth?
That's because the Bible acknowledges that not everyone will absolutely, faithfully follow the same Church. The Bible knows better than you; this is a problem that cannot be solved.
A "solution" that cannot be implemented is no solution at all.
[b]However, societies have achieved it throughout history and that demonstrates that it is possible. ed being violent, there would be no more violence.
Yay! I found the solution to violence!
No, dude, that's not possible. It is human nature to be a wolf to our own kind. That is homo homini lupus.
However, if as I do, you believe that the optimum is a society where all have the opportunity to be happy, with a 'same level start' in life, and those few who happen to break the rules are effectively placed aside, and the rest can walk the streets knowing that there are 99% chances of returning home without a scratch, then trust me: It is possible.
The Nordic countries have problems, and a lot, but they have managed to create a society very similar to the one described above. It is possible, then.
Originally posted by SeitseI agree for a hundred percent. Neither you or I can find a solution in the short term, but your approach is THE one. Oh yes ..., and tolerance and perseverance (for longer than we would like).
Do you disagree with my answer?
So education, honest government, and economic growth are not the solutions for crime?
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Originally posted by whodeyhttp://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/La_Violencia#Development
And what are the majority of crimes in LA related to? Are they not related to gangs? I think organized crime on average tends to be much more violent in nature than people going it alone, but I may be wrong about that. It's just a guess.
I heard that the worst gangs and most violent gangs are coming from Mexico and into the states. From what I hear the ...[text shortened]... ople. It would then stand to reason that these groups must be targeted in some way or another.
"The conflict was especially cruel and violent. Due to the scarcity of guns, killings were frequently carried out with machetes and other crude implements. Torture and rape were common. Groups developed unique and horrific forms of corpse desecration as their signatures. For instance, the Corte Franela (literally "T-shirt cut" ) was characterized by severed arms and decapitation, the Corte Corbata ("Necktie cut" ) by a split-open throat and tongue placed over the chest, and the Corte Florero ("Flower Vase cut" ) by severed arms and legs inserted in the torso like a floral arrangement."
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Originally posted by surtismTreat young offenders early -- as young as they start misbehaving. Apparently age 8 is about the optimal age for treating antisocial behaviour. You particularly want to target the lifecourse-persistent group of offenders, who start their offending before the age of 14.
This is a serious question, what is happening in the streets of the UK? The youth are running riot, knife and gun crime is on the increase, rape and sexual assaults abound and the hands of the police are tied, if they try to crack down on crime then they get attacked by gangs as in Manchester last week. If they do manage to arrest somebody then they cannot ...[text shortened]... t up with this?
Just some gentle dinner debate from tonight, any thoughts????
Stay safe!
Once someone gets big and ugly enough to commit a serious violent crime, there's little left to do with them but lock them away for a very long time and throw away the key. It won't rehabilitate them, but at least society will be safe from them while they're in prison, which should be as long as possible. So more prison construction, and longer sentences, especially for serious violent crimes. Anyone who commits murder should invariably receive life imprisonment, which should mean literally what it says.
Rehabilitation is best targeted at young offenders, especially those under the age of 14, as noted above.
Oh, and the death penalty doesn't seem to work; crime rates are higher in US states that have the death penalty than those that don't have it, and higher in the US than Western countries that don't have the death penalty. Also, Roe v Wade is good because would-be criminals are sometimes aborted when the would-be mother (often an adolescent girl in an inner-city ghetto) makes this choice.
Originally posted by SeitseSo you're pushing for a Nordic model of government. Is that right?
Wait, wait, wait... do you really believe that violence can be eradicated completely from the face of the earth?
No, dude, that's not possible. It is human nature to be a wolf to our own kind. That is homo homini lupus.
However, if as I do, you believe that the optimum is a society where all have the opportunity to be happy, with a 'same leve ...[text shortened]... ve managed to create a society very similar to the one described above. It is possible, then.[/b]