Brexit reflections so far

Originally posted by FMF
I have given you a range of political reasons. They can be read in my posts on the last few pages. Attempting to summarize them with "all you can tell me because I say it is because you say it is" won't wash.

I am sorry but you have not given a single example of a credible tangible benefit and have simply stated that devolution of power is good because you say it is, that is not a reason, its an opinion. Let me try to help you.

Leaving the UK is good because we will have more control of immigration is a concrete tangible benefit of the devolvement of power, its is not an ethereal notion masquerading as reason, its a reason substantiated with a concrete example.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I am uninterested in you silly semantic questions and they will be ignored .

The question struck to the very heart of your stance as to what "benefit" actually means and who perceives it. It was not "semantic" at all.

Originally posted by FMF
But this is not the argument I have been putting forward.

please see the above post it may help you formulate a reason.

Leaving the UK is good because . . . . .we will have more control of immigration a concrete tangible benefit of the devolvement of power.

This is not an ethereal notion masquerading as reason, its a reason substantiated with a concrete example. So do you have any?

Originally posted by FMF
The question struck to the very heart of your stance as to what "benefit" actually means and who perceives it. It was not "semantic" at all.

Uninterested it has nothing to do with what I am attempting to ascertain.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I am sorry but you have not given a single example of a credible tangible benefit and have simply stated that devolution of power is good because you say it is, that is not a reason, its an opinion.

Are you looking for examples of where devolution has benefited the UK in the last 6 days?

Originally posted by FMF
Are you looking for examples of where devolution has benefited the UK in the last 6 days?

I am looking for examples where you think that devolution will benefit the UK at any time, do you have any?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Leaving the UK is good because we will have more control of immigration is a concrete tangible benefit of the devolvement of power, its is not an ethereal notion masquerading as reason, its a reason substantiated with a concrete example.

The devolution ~ or restoration ~ of political power to Britain affects the full gamut of issues, visa controls and citizenship and residency issues are just a few of them. There would be countless issues. This is what I have been talking about all along when I have mentioned increased political and democratic control of policies. You should have realized this.

Originally posted by FMF
The devolution ~ or restoration ~ of political power to Britain affects the full gamut of issues, visa controls and citizenship and residency issues are just a few of them. There would be countless issues. This is what I have been talking about all along when I have mentioned increased political and democratic control of policies. You should have realized this.

Really and Britain as a member of the EU has ceded power to affect the full gamut of issues affecting immigration from and to the EU and elsewhere? What powers have we ceded that will be restored?

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I am looking for examples where you think that devolution will benefit the UK at any time, do you have any?

Whether the changes and decisions and outcomes are of "benefit" item by item will be for each and every resident and voter in the UK to decide ~ and attempt to influence.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Really and Britain as a member of the EU has ceded power to affect the full gamut of issues affecting immigration from and to the EU and elsewhere?

I didn't say anything about "the full gamut of issues affecting immigration". I don't know what you mean by that. I said that immigration issues are just one part of a whole gamut of aspects of political power and consequences that will come under the increased control of the UK, having had that power shifted back from the European mechanism.

Originally posted by FMF
I didn't say anything about "the full gamut of issues affecting immigration". I don't know what you mean by that. I said that immigration issues are just one part of a whole gamut of aspects of political power and consequences that will come under the increased control of the UK, having had that power shifted back from the European mechanism.

Lets ask you again, what powers have the UK ceded that will be restored.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
What powers have we ceded that will be restored?

That's something you can look up for yourself. Despite the debate in Britain being so ugly and shallow for most of the time, the information about legal matters, obligations and rights that go with membership of the E.U. is readily available.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
Lets ask you again, what powers have the UK ceded that will be restored.

That's something you can look up for yourself. I have simply been challenging you on your assertion that no "tangible benefits" have been cited by those agreeing with an exit from the E.U.

Originally posted by FMF
That's something you can look up for yourself. Despite the debate in Britain being so ugly and shallow for most of the time, the information about legal matters, obligations and rights that go with membership of the E.U. is readily available.

You don't know and yet you made the statement in response to a specific question about which powers have we have ceded and I quote, 'the full gamut of visa controls and citizenship and residency issues'. What visa controls, residency issues and citizenship issues have we ceded to the EU so that they will be able to restore them. Did you simply make it up? it certainly sounds like it.

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
You don't know and yet you made the statement in response to a specific question about which powers have we have ceded and I quote, 'the full gamut of visa controls and citizenship and residency issues'. What visa controls, residency issues and citizenship issues have we ceded to the EU so that they will be able to restore them. Did you simply make it up? it certainly sounds like it.

E.U. citizens from 20+ countries have residency rights and rights to work and rights to buy property that are in many cases indistinguishable from those of U.K. citizens. This will most likely not be the case anymore in about 2 or 3 years from now. I'll let Brexiteers explain it to you.