Originally posted by roma45
wow..you seriously think torture is okay? it will save lives they do it so we do it?

dont you think its possible some poor guy who is innocent and knows nothing might be tortured.

i suppose there is no innocent people in usa jails?

any nation or person would would willing torture another human being what ever pathetic reason they may have are worse than the enemy

No, I do not condone torture...I said no to waterboarding. But then I gave a very extreme example...most likely found only in the movies. And in that very specific, limited example I said yes. Torturing, in general, reduces us to a savage mentality and the civilized world is better than that.

My answer was honest. And perhaps if you think on it, you will agree. You cannot tell me if your city was about to have a nuclear bomb dropped on it and one terrorist's information could prevent thousands of innocent men, women and children's deaths, that you would vote to save the one monster just on principle? That is hard to believe and "looks good on paper" as they say, but the reality is such that if your family was directly threatened, I think you might re-consider.

Again, that is a really bad example only because I doubt there is ever a real life situation where it would actually play out like that.

I'm still reeling about the blown up airliner earlier this month and Friday's horrific tragedy so maybe it is a bad time to ask me. I think these terrorists are not people who value human life, they are barbaric monsters ...in their own category.

I drank my coffee this morning while reading a report describing people being pulled up onto the stage in the concert hall and being executed at point blank range. I almost threw up imagining that scenerio.

Originally posted by Landisqueen170
No, I do not condone torture...I said no to waterboarding. But then I gave a very extreme example...most likely found only in the movies. And in that very specific, limited example I said yes. Torturing, in general, reduces us to a savage mentality and the civilized world is better than that.

My answer was honest. And perhaps if you think on it, yo ...[text shortened]... concert hall and being executed at point blank range. I almost threw up imagining that scenerio.

so a little torture is okay in certain circumstances?
where do you stop? waterboarding not working thousands of lives are in line.
do you go a step further, this guy you captured is a barbaric monster in your mind.
do you start using a drill or removing body parts to get him to talk

once you start the torture route there is no going back.

Originally posted by roma45
so a little torture is okay in certain circumstances?
where do you stop? waterboarding not working thousands of lives are in line.
do you go a step further, this guy you captured is a barbaric monster in your mind.
do you start using a drill or removing body parts to get him to talk

once you start the torture route there is no going back.

I do not pretend to know the "right" thing to do in all war scenerios. It is certainly complicated and very distressing.

I gave you my honest answer. You don't have to like it. But it was honest and how I am feeling currently.

I do not condone torture. My answer was extremely specific and I still say if your entire city including your own family was in grave danger of the most horrific kind, you might re-consider. If not, you are simply a better person than I.

Back in day, most nations adhered to the Geneva Conventions. There was some war time "rules" as screwy as that may seem. The bad guys these days adhere to nothing. They are held to no standard. They behead whenever they feel like it, crash planes, massacre innocent civilians of mixed nationalities.

Easy for us to all say what we would and wouldn't do when it is far removed from our real lives.

Originally posted by Landisqueen170
I do not pretend to know the "right" thing to do in all war scenerios. It is certainly complicated and very distressing.

I gave you my honest answer. You don't have to like it. But it was honest and how I am feeling currently.

I do not condone torture. My answer was extremely specific and I still say if your entire city including your own famil ...[text shortened]... Easy for us to all say what we would and wouldn't do when it is far removed from our real lives.

I think pouring water on Roma is a great idea, throw in some shower gel, those Perth tattie howkers can sure get muddy! He may need to be tied down to prevent him running away.

Originally posted by Landisqueen170
I do not pretend to know the "right" thing to do in all war scenerios. It is certainly complicated and very distressing.

I gave you my honest answer. You don't have to like it. But it was honest and how I am feeling currently.

I do not condone torture. My answer was extremely specific and I still say if your entire city including your own famil ...[text shortened]... Easy for us to all say what we would and wouldn't do when it is far removed from our real lives.

I do not condone torture. My answer was extremely specific and I still say if your entire city including your own family was in grave danger of the most horrific kind, you might re-consider. If not, you are simply a better person than I.

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the thing is if you lower yourself to their level, there is nothing worth fighting for, you might as well join them

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
I think pouring water on Roma is a great idea, throw in some shower gel, those Perth tattie howkers can sure get muddy! He may need to be tied down to prevent him running away.

leave the insults in the old forum

i wont take the bait

Originally posted by roma45
leave the insults in the old forum

i wont take the bait

Ouch busted again!

Originally posted by roma45
I do not condone torture. My answer was extremely specific and I still say if your entire city including your own family was in grave danger of the most horrific kind, you might re-consider. If not, you are simply a better person than I.

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the thing ...[text shortened]... lower yourself to their level, there is nothing worth fighting for, you might as well join them

You are stating the obvious.

So what are your suggestions? How can we ever all agree on what constitutes torture? Is slapping a terrorist for vital info too much? Depriving him of sunlight for months at a time? Not honoring his dietary restrictions? Surely that these things are inhumane and will cause him mental anguish or physical discomfort.

I understand your point but I do think in my extreme example all bets are off the table.

If the terrorist won't talk and your city is about to implode, I cannot imagine you walk away and say, "Oh well, I asked him sternly and he just wouldn't fess up." I think you would be frantically doing whatever you had to do to save thousands of innocent lives.

The post that was quoted here has been removed

lol lol


😀

Originally posted by Landisqueen170
You are stating the obvious.

So what are your suggestions? How can we ever all agree on what constitutes torture? Is slapping a terrorist for vital info too much? Depriving him of sunlight for months at a time? Not honoring his dietary restrictions? Surely that these things are inhumane and will cause him mental anguish or physical discomfort.

I ...[text shortened]... think you would be frantically doing whatever you had to do to save thousands of innocent lives.

The main point you are missing. I will dumb it down for you.
You are not jack from 24. Torturing someone wont stop a nuke.
Any prisoner deserves to be treated humanly, no matter what they have done, if we go down the dark road of being like them, they have won.
You say they are barbaric monsters, well if you want us to be the good guys we have to act like the good guys

Originally posted by roma45
The main point you are missing. I will dumb it down for you.
You are not jack from 24. Torturing someone wont stop a nuke.
Any prisoner deserves to be treated humanly, no matter what they have done, if we go down the dark road of being like them, they have won.
You say they are barbaric monsters, well if you want us to be the good guys we have to act like the good guys

kissy kissy womadwool, for you and wadiodweeb

Originally posted by robbie carrobie
kissy kissy womadwool, for you and wadiodweeb

coming from a man who wont wear a poppy to support our war dead.
get a life robbie