Are most scientists sniveling fearful conformists?

@metal-brain said
You are using the term Machiavellianism as a euphemism for psychopath. Kissinger was behind the overthrow of a democracy in Chile and probably the recent coup attempts in Venezuela to also overthrow a democracy.

https://www.globalresearch.ca/crimes-against-humanity-why-is-henry-kissinger-walking-around-free/5358322

https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/the-trials-of-henry-kissinger/

One death is a tragedy; one million is a statistic.

Joseph Stalin

No, I am using the word machiavellianism to mean just that. Psychologists talk about a Dark Triad: Psychopathy, Narcissism and Machiavellianism. Machiavellianism is not a synonym for psychopathy. There are personality disorders associated with the first two, but not the third. Machiavellianism is sub-clinical meaning it does not require treatment.

Further I said that if Kissinger has anything then he has Machiavellianism, but frankly we have no evidence for any kind of psychological issue. I know you think he is evil, but evil is not a medical problem for doctors to cure and those who have personality disorders are not necessarily evil. It is perfectly possible that Kissinger has done all that he has done with a "normal" psychological profile.

Just to reinforce this point - people with the following conditions: Avoidant, Schizotypal and Schizoid personality disorders are, as a rule, harmless and tend to suffer themselves without causing much harm to those around them. People with Obsessive Compulsive Personality Disorder - the egosyntonic variant of OCD - are great workers - they want to work 12 hours a day six days a week. The problem is they don't understand why anyone else wouldn't so they can make awful bosses.

We do have some evidence that Assange is a narcissist. Not enough to diagnose him, and we aren't qualified to anyway, but it's interesting to talk about. One thing Assange is simply not responsible for is his own narcissism. Suppose for argument's sake that he does indeed have narcissistic personality disorder. Then he will have started developing this from an early age as his parents relationship started to fall apart. Again for argument's sake he was seven. He simply did not have the mental equipment at the time to defend against it. Once he has the condition then he's just going to regard himself as psychologically normal, but clearly such a genius that he is the only one who can save Mankind from the evil Western Governments. What he is responsible for, if the accusation is true, is the rape in Sweden. He has the cognitive equipment to understand that he does not have consent to attempt to have sex with a sleeping woman and is therefore responsible for that.

It's not obvious to me that someone who attempts espionage against the U.S. from a foreign country has committed a crime the US has jurisdiction over. It is somewhere between possible and likely that whichever country he was in at the time he conspired with Bradley Manning (now Chelsea) has legislation making it illegal to attempt freelance espionage operations in their country and, if so, I would have thought that they were the relevant prosecuting authority.

@metal-brain said
Julian Assange wrote something critical of most physicists:

In a 2006 blog post, he wrote about the attendees at a physics conference and called the scientists “sniveling fearful conformists.”

https://www.simplemost.com/things-you-may-not-know-about-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange/?lvl=single2&stack=ssp&utm_source=facebook-adrizer&utm_campaign=142288&utm_term&utm ...[text shortened]... 7gMG-_cp3gIa5WAHYic8abD_90MNl2uU

Why do you think Assange has that perception of most physicists?

So the clickbait article "WWW.simplemost.com/Things-you-may-not-know-About-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange"
(you can Clip all the junk after that if you post links. We are not interested in the fact that you clicked a facebbook link)

All the infromation brought About this was what you quoted. The blog post was not linked, so we can't know the circumstances.
2006 was before his whistle-blower Career took off. So we can discard the idea that he wanted physicist to applaud.

We have no infromation for any meaningful discussuion.

I hold on to my earlier opinion, that we can talk ablut conformism if you put Forward some Thesis of your own.

@ponderable said
So the clickbait article "WWW.simplemost.com/Things-you-may-not-know-About-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange"
(you can Clip all the junk after that if you post links. We are not interested in the fact that you clicked a facebbook link)

All the infromation brought About this was what you quoted. The blog post was not linked, so we can't know the circumstances.
2006 was ...[text shortened]... to my earlier opinion, that we can talk ablut conformism if you put Forward some Thesis of your own.

According to Assange's Wikipedia page 2006 was the year WikiLeaks was founded. It is entirely plausible that he was trying to promote the site to Physicists. Why he would think it was an appropriate place to do that is anyone's guess.

@deepthought said
According to his Wikipedia page Assange attended 3 universities.

Attended and flunked. That makes him no better a physicist, or indeed scientist in general, than I am with my potential B.Sc. CS (Ægrot.).

@deepthought said
No, I am using the word machiavellianism to mean just that. Psychologists talk about a Dark Triad: Psychopathy, Narcissism and Machiavellianism. Machiavellianism is not a synonym for psychopathy. There are personality disorders associated with the first two, but not the third. Machiavellianism is sub-clinical meaning it does not require treatment.

Further I said th ...[text shortened]... in their country and, if so, I would have thought that they were the relevant prosecuting authority.

Machiavellian ism is not a condition. By using the term you are denying anything is wrong with Kissinger. He kills people, but he has others carry out the assassinations like an organized crime syndicate orders hits on people.

One death is a tragedy; one million is a statistic.
Joseph Stalin

Machiavellian ism to you is acceptable murder. It is a way for you to condone evil and that makes you part of the problem.


“The world is a dangerous place to live, not because of the people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it.”

― Albert Einstein

@deepthought said
No, I am using the word machiavellianism to mean just that. Psychologists talk about a Dark Triad: Psychopathy, Narcissism and Machiavellianism. Machiavellianism is not a synonym for psychopathy. There are personality disorders associated with the first two, but not the third. Machiavellianism is sub-clinical meaning it does not require treatment.

Further I said th ...[text shortened]... in their country and, if so, I would have thought that they were the relevant prosecuting authority.

You are clearly biased against Assange to the point you are convinced he is a narcissist based on evidence that doesn't really exist. His parents broke up. So what? That would make half of the population narcissists.

Not enough to diagnose him is right. I'm glad you admit that, so stop trying to say you have some evidence when you don't.

https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/blog/head-games/201606/how-narcissists-got-way

All you are doing is trying to justify a rumor started by a judge, not a psychologist. Now you are a physicist pretending to be a psychologist because you read some left wing conspiracy theory about Russia colluding with Assange based on a rumor started by republican Paul Ryan.

There is the other name calling. Paul Ryan made "sycophant" a popular word by falsely linking Assange to Russia with that word. Paul Ryan in reality is a sycophant for the elite establishment, but the name calling was effective propaganda and people from the left accepted the conspiracy theory from the right without question because that is what they wanted to believe anyway.

You remind me of that woman psychologist in that Direct TV commercial. The woman is rambling on about Direct TV while ignoring the patient and he asks if they are going to talk about him. She mutters "classic narcissist" as she writes it down.

@shallow-blue said
Attended and flunked. That makes him no better a physicist, or indeed scientist in general, than I am with my potential B.Sc. CS (Ægrot.).

The article says that he did not complete the degrees, it does not say that he failed any exams.

@metal-brain said
Machiavellian ism is not a condition. By using the term you are denying anything is wrong with Kissinger. He kills people, but he has others carry out the assassinations like an organized crime syndicate orders hits on people.

One death is a tragedy; one million is a statistic.
Joseph Stalin

Machiavellian ism to you is acceptable murder. It is a way for you to con ...[text shortened]... people who are evil, but because of the people who don't do anything about it.”

― Albert Einstein

Do you really think that people only commit crimes like murder due to psychiatric conditions?

@metal-brain said
You are clearly biased against Assange to the point you are convinced he is a narcissist based on evidence that doesn't really exist. His parents broke up. So what? That would make half of the population narcissists.

Not enough to diagnose him is right. I'm glad you admit that, so stop trying to say you have some evidence when you don't.

https://www.psychologytoday ...[text shortened]... he asks if they are going to talk about him. She mutters "classic narcissist" as she writes it down.

Well, since the prevalence of personality disorders is between 9% and 15%. The prevalence of Narcissistic Personality Disorder is about 3%, so I'll hazard a guess, and it is a guess, that one might expect to find a level of narcissism strong enough to describe them as narcissistic in 10% to 20% of the population.

...you read some left wing conspiracy theory about Russia colluding with Assange based on a rumor started by republican Paul Ryan.

More projection. You show little ability to distinguish left wing and right wing politics. You are accusing Paul Ryan, a Republican, of starting a left wing rumour. This is incoherent, if your rumour was started by a Republican then it is a right wing rumour. As it happens I don't think there's any need for the Russians to collude with Assange, he's acting in their interests anyway so they may as well leave him to get on with it.

@metal-brain said
Julian Assange wrote something critical of most physicists:

In a 2006 blog post, he wrote about the attendees at a physics conference and called the scientists “sniveling fearful conformists.”

https://www.simplemost.com/things-you-may-not-know-about-wikileaks-founder-julian-assange/?lvl=single2&stack=ssp&utm_source=facebook-adrizer&utm_campaign=142288&utm_term&utm ...[text shortened]... 7gMG-_cp3gIa5WAHYic8abD_90MNl2uU

Why do you think Assange has that perception of most physicists?

In my experience, most scientists are deep outside-the-box thinkers who enjoy provocative new ideas and their contribution to the creation of knowledge.

You can try attending a scientific conference and forming your own opinion.

@wildgrass said
In my experience, most scientists are deep outside-the-box thinkers who enjoy provocative new ideas and their contribution to the creation of knowledge.

You can try attending a scientific conference and forming your own opinion.

Most scientists must be more open minded than those on this forum then. Most on here are so conformity driven they will resort to BS instead of admitting they are wrong, all in an effort to maintain the status quo.

I sometimes offer theories that depart from the status quo to find out how they might be flawed. I have no problem being proven wrong, I have a problem with people pretending I am wrong with absolutely no proof of it whatsoever.

People seem to be easily duped by jargon. That is one of the reasons I like the Feynman Technique. Einstein knew the same basic concept as well.

"If you can't explain it simply, you don't understand it well enough."
-Albert Einstein

@deepthought said
Do you really think that people only commit crimes like murder due to psychiatric conditions?

Yes. Lack of empathy is a basic form of psychiatric condition. We have different names for the different degrees of apathy. There is the narcissist, sociopath and psychopath. One could argue these are just a bunch of fancy names for a-holes, but Kissinger is just evil. You have euphemisms for evil to condone it when your news sources desensitize you to it.

Do you really think Dr. Evil Kissinger is any different than an organized crime boss? Let's play a game called "Machiavellian or evil?"

Gaddafi
Abe Lincoln
Mussolini
Abu Musab Al-Zarqawi
Milosevic
Stalin
Hitler
Mao
Leopold II
Joseph Meldish
Saddam Hussein
Shah of Iran
MBS (Mr. bonesaw)
Chester Wheeler Campbell
Pinochet
Jimmy Carter
Ronald Reagan
Carlo Gambino
James Joseph "Whitey" Bulger Jr.
Osama Bin Laden

Which are they? "Machiavellian or evil?"

@metal-brain said
Most scientists must be more open minded than those on this forum then.

Not so 'open minded' that they would take your stupid beliefs seriously.

"By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out. "

Richard Dawkins

@metal-brain said
Yes. Lack of empathy is a basic form of psychiatric condition. We have different names for the different degrees of apathy. There is the narcissist, sociopath and psychopath. One could argue these are just a bunch of fancy names for a-holes, but Kissinger is just evil. You have euphemisms for evil to condone it when your news sources desensitize you to it.

Do you reall ...[text shortened]... bino
James Joseph "Whitey" Bulger Jr.
Osama Bin Laden

Which are they? "Machiavellian or evil?"

Members of the dark triad do not lack all empathy. What they lack is what psychologists call affective empathy. They do have cognitive empathy - they would be utterly unable to manipulate people if they did not. Now, Kissinger may well lack affective empathy, I don't know, but one feature is that it's intuitive and immediate. Since Kissinger isn't present when the battle takes place there's no opportunity for his affective empathy to kick in - if he has it.

Further, given your behaviour on this forum, and your deliberate abuse of all the other people who post here regularly, I feel I should point out that you are showing dark triad traits. So you might want to think about who you are calling "a-holes". I'll judge these people on what they've done, not what psychological conditions they have.