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13 Feb 22
@rajk999 saidYou don’t understand that it’s only through the power of God’s Holy Spirit indwelling a believer that one can “be like Christ.”
Which is the greater virtue?
[This thread is not to encourage comments on specific people, or what they do or do not do. Posters who are interested in personalizing their comments will be ignored]
*First* comes the acceptance and belief in Jesus Christ and belief in His Resurrection, then comes forgiveness of sins, then comes the indwelling of God’s Holy Spirit and then comes the process of sanctification, as God’s Holy Spirit transforms a believer’s heart and desires and behavior.
You’re trying to “be like Christ” without Christ.
It doesn’t work that way.
13 Feb 22
@josephw saidNo argument there. Paul fashioned his life after the teachings of Christ. Many, if not all of the Apostles did the same.
Paul was like Christ.
Paul was also a great teacher, who led not only with words but also by example. So there are two sides to these biblical personalities, words and action.
Is it possible to have a great preacher of the Gospel who is not a great follower of the Gospel
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13 Feb 22
@rajk999 saidPaul was mostly known for mission trips and evangelizing - what you have termed “mouth worship.”
No argument there. Paul fashioned his life after the teachings of Christ. Many, if not all of the Apostles did the same.
Paul was also a great teacher, who led not only with words but also by example. So there are two sides to these biblical personalities, words and action.
Is it possible to have a great preacher of the Gospel who is not a great follower of the Gospel
Can you cite a single example of Paul doing “good works” as you define good works?
And Paul struggled to “keep the commandments” as he wrote about in a personal way in Romans 7 and in a general way in Galatians.
According to your false doctrine, Paul was a failure as a Christian - just a lot of “mouth worship.”
God, it’s so easy to expose your false doctrine and rip it to shreds.
13 Feb 22
@pb1022 saidPosts containing personal comments will be ignored.
You don’t understand that it’s only through the power of God’s Holy Spirit indwelling a believer that one can “be like Christ.”
*First* comes the acceptance and belief in Jesus Christ and belief in His Resurrection, then comes forgiveness of sins, then comes the indwelling of God’s Holy Spirit and then comes the process of sanctification, as God’s Holy Spirit transforms a b ...[text shortened]... ires and behavior.
You’re trying to “be like Christ” without Christ.
It doesn’t work that way.
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13 Feb 22
@rajk999 saidIt’s your false doctrine, not mine - and not Jesus Christ’s.
Posts containing personal comments will be ignored.
If you can’t defend it (and you can’t,) that’s on you.
But I can understand you searching for any excuse not to explain how Paul was nothing but a mouth worshipper according to your false doctrine.
13 Feb 22
@rajk999 saidNeither, our virtue is either from Jesus or our own.
So which in your opinion is the greater virtue
- a doer of the Gospel or
- a preacher of the Gospel
Of course there is no argument that the best to be both
2 Corinthians 5:21
For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.
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@rajk999 saidA preacher of the Gospel *is.* a doer of the Gospel.
So which in your opinion is the greater virtue
- a doer of the Gospel or
- a preacher of the Gospel
Of course there is no argument that the best to be both
Saving souls is arguably much more important than brushing snow off your neighbor’s car five years ago and patting yourself on the back for doing that ever since.
13 Feb 22
@kellyjay saidWhat about people who lived before the birth of Jesus Christ?
Neither, our virtue is either from Jesus or our own.
2 Corinthians 5:21
For our sake he made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God.
Does not the bible speak of virtues and which are greater?
13 Feb 22
@rajk999 saidIt is always by faith, we trust God so we do those things pleasing to Him even if it costs us all. Before Jesus came as a man Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego put their faith in God and declared if they perish they perish God knows His own. You should read the book of Hebrews.
What about people who lived before the birth of Jesus Christ?
Does not the bible speak of virtues and which are greater?
Daniel 3
Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego answered and said to the king, “O Nebuchadnezzar, we have no need to answer you in this matter. If this be so, our God whom we serve is able to deliver us from the burning fiery furnace, and he will deliver us out of your hand, O king. But if not, be it known to you, O king, that we will not serve your gods or worship the golden image that you have set up.”
Then Nebuchadnezzar was filled with fury, and the expression of his face was changed against Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. He ordered the furnace heated seven times more than it was usually heated. And he ordered some of the mighty men of his army to bind Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, and to cast them into the burning fiery furnace. Then these men were bound in their cloaks, their tunics, their hats, and their other garments, and they were thrown into the burning fiery furnace. Because the king's order was urgent and the furnace overheated, the flame of the fire killed those men who took up Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego. And these three men, Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego, fell bound into the burning fiery furnace.
Then King Nebuchadnezzar was astonished and rose up in haste. He declared to his counselors, “Did we not cast three men bound into the fire?” They answered and said to the king, “True, O king.” He answered and said, “But I see four men unbound, walking in the midst of the fire, and they are not hurt; and the appearance of the fourth is like a son of the gods.”
13 Feb 22
@kellyjay saidThanks for not answering the question.
It is always by faith, we trust God so we do those things pleasing to Him even if it costs us all. Before Jesus came as a man Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego put their faith in God and declared if they perish they perish God knows His own. You should read the book of Hebrews.
Daniel 3
Shadrach, Meshach, and Abednego answered and said to the king, “O Nebuchadnezzar, we ...[text shortened]... dst of the fire, and they are not hurt; and the appearance of the fourth is like a son of the gods.”
That says a lot.
13 Feb 22
1 edit
@rajk999 saidMatthew 23:1-3
So which in your opinion is the greater virtue
- a doer of the Gospel or
- a preacher of the Gospel
Of course there is no argument that the best to be both
¶ Then spake Jesus.., Saying,
The scribes and the Pharisees sit in Moses' seat:
All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
Romans 2:13
(For not the hearers of the law are just before God, but the doers of the law shall be justified.
James 1:22
But be ye doers of the word, and not hearers only, deceiving your own selves.
I'm taking those verses out of context, of course, but they do seem to indicate or infer that one can't have one without the other.
One confesses that Jesus Christ is Lord, then repents, then is born again by the Spirit of God and strives to live a sanctified life.