Originally posted by @sonship

Read letter antichrists, IMO, are so-called teachers of the New Testament that regard (or appear to regard) only the quotations of Jesus. But their intention is to [b]contradict the New Testament proclamation concerning Jesus Christ.

Now Christ's words on the so-called Sermon on the Mount are wonderful. Take the blessings o ...[text shortened]... His blood does not render His word on living a kingdom life not a part of His ministry as well.[/b]

The beatitudes are very important. Only one wanting to present "another Jesus" would say that because of the beatitudes this does not matter.

<< "For this is My blood of the covenant, which is being poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins." (26:28)>>

Jaywill the truth of the matter is that it's your interpretation of Matthew 26:28 that is flawed. Why are you pretending that this isn't what's at issue? It has nothing to do with the Beatitudes.

I've posted on this many times before. In fact, once already on this very thread. Why do you dishonestly keep pretending that I haven't?

Once again:
To understand what Jesus is saying there, you'll need to understand it in context of other things Jesus said.

1) The word given as "forgiveness" in your translation literally means "freedom".

2) In John 6 Jesus also speaks of "eating", "bread", "body/flesh", "drinking" and "blood". wherein Jesus uses the metaphor of "eating flesh", "drinking blood" to refer to " the words that I have spoken to you". In short, one "eats" and "drinks" His words so that they will abide in Him.

3) In John 15 Jesus explains that "abiding" in Him entails "keep[ing] His commandments" (words).

4) In John 8 Jesus explain that those who "abide in [His] words" will be made "free" from committing sin.

So when Jesus tells them to eat His body (flesh) and drink His blood, He is really speaking of them eating and drinking His words just as He does in John 6.

So what Jesus means in Matthew 26:28 is "for [these are My words] of the covenant, which is poured out for many for [freedom from] sins" which parallels what He said in John 8 about those who abide in His word being freed from committing sin.

This makes so much more sense than Him making some really awkward reference to His future death. Especially in light of Luke 22:19 where He says "do this in remembrance of Me." He's asking them to do it in remembrance of the words He has spoken - NOT in "remembrance" of His death which hasn't happened yet.

This isn't to mention the various reasons that Jesus' death on the cross does not constitute a valid sacrificial shedding of blood.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
[b]The beatitudes are very important. Only one wanting to present "another Jesus" would say that because of the beatitudes this does not matter.

<< "For this is My blood of the covenant, which is being poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins." (26:28)>>

Jaywill the truth of the matter is that it's your interpretation of Matthew 26:28 th ...[text shortened]... easons that Jesus' death on the cross does not constitute a valid sacrificial shedding of blood.[/b]

Jesus said HIS words are Spirit and life.

Christians say THEIR words are Spirit and life.

They proclaim their faith with their mouth and immediately
- they receive the Holy Spirit
- they have life eternal.

Nothing to do with Jesus's words... their words is everything.

Originally posted by @rajk999
Jesus said HIS words are Spirit and life.

Christians say THEIR words are Spirit and life.

They proclaim their faith with their mouth and immediately
- they receive the Holy Spirit
- they have life eternal.

Nothing to do with Jesus's words... their words is everything.

Narrtivium is powerful stuff

Originally posted by @rajk999
Jesus said HIS words are Spirit and life.

Christians say THEIR words are Spirit and life.

They proclaim their faith with their mouth and immediately
- they receive the Holy Spirit
- they have life eternal.

Nothing to do with Jesus's words... their words is everything.

Narrtivium is powerful stuff

Originally posted by @rajk999
Jesus said HIS words are Spirit and life.

Christians say THEIR words are Spirit and life.

They proclaim their faith with their mouth and immediately
- they receive the Holy Spirit
- they have life eternal.

Nothing to do with Jesus's words... their words is everything.

It’s not proclaiming faith with the mouth. It’s about believing in Christ in one’s heart.

I would wager there are scores of people who say they are Christians and go to church every Sunday but who are not saved because they don’t believe in Christ in their hearts.

Originally posted by @thinkofone
[b]The beatitudes are very important. Only one wanting to present "another Jesus" would say that because of the beatitudes this does not matter.

<< "For this is My blood of the covenant, which is being poured out for many for the forgiveness of sins." (26:28)>>

Jaywill the truth of the matter is that it's your interpretation of Matthew 26:28 th ...[text shortened]... easons that Jesus' death on the cross does not constitute a valid sacrificial shedding of blood.[/b]

Jaywill the truth of the matter is that it's your interpretation of Matthew 26:28 that is flawed. Why are you pretending that this isn't what's at issue? It has nothing to do with the Beatitudes.
-------------------------------------------------------------------
We've been through this before, haven't we?
Did I say it had to do with the Beatitudes?

The new covenant has to do with God inscribing His law into our hearts. That is something living must be inscribed on somewthing else living.

The life of God in Jesus is living.
And our hearts are living.
Christ must be dispensed into man's being.

Christ cannot be dispensed into man's being unless man is justified to be able to come to God. You're mistaken if you do not think justification is not needed through Christ's pouring out of His blood "for the forgiveness of sins"

cont. below

I've posted on this many times before. In fact, once already on this very thread. Why do you dishonestly keep pretending that I haven't?
-------------------------------------

Excuse me but you are HONESTLY WRONG.
The New Covenant promised by God involved God subjectively dispensing His life and His Spirit into forgiven sinners.

If you think Jesus' words about the covenant established in His blood is something else, you're honestly wrong.

You don't realize the problem between sinful man and the holy God of perfect righteousness.

God is willing to forgive. But not in the sloppy and sentimental liberal way of humanism. God is willing to forgive with the realization on man's part that it COST something.

He did not just say " I know you didn't mean it. Let's just overlook the matter." No, He JUDGED the sins. And He came as a man to BEAR that judgment.

So forget about persuading this Christian that the Lord's words were idle there.

"And similarly the cup after they had dined, saying, This cup is the new covenant established in My blood, which is being poured out for you." (Luke 22:20)

Do you think it was being poured out for man just to be an example of dedication? It was being poured out for propitiation and the forgiveness of sins.

"For this is My blood of the covenant, which is being poured out for the forgiveness of sins." (Matt. 26:28)

Reading "freedom" there for "forgiveness" doesn't make much difference. The forgiveness is FREEDOM from the guilt and judgment of eternal damnation.

Freedom from the power of sin can now be worked out as He writes His living life and nature into the hearts of those eternally forgiven. Read Jeremiah 31:31-34.

Originally posted by @thinkofone

This makes so much more sense than Him making some really awkward reference to His future death. Especially in light of Luke 22:19 where He says "do this in remembrance of Me." He's asking them to do it in remembrance of the words He has spoken - NOT in "remembrance" of His death which hasn't happened yet.

This isn't to mention the various reasons that Jesus' death on the cross does not constitute a valid sacrificial shedding of blood.

Going back to the blood of the paschal lamb in Exodus, we see that it was something that God had to see. He said "When I see the blood, I will pass over you."

The firstborn was in the house. The blood was on the outside of the house for God to see. It doesn't say God looked inside of the house to see the condition of the firstborn child. As long as the blood of the lamb was on the outside of the door for God to see, He would passover in judgment.

The symbolism is significant.

Now, inside the house they ATE the lamb. And they ATE the lamb for strength to be able to leave Egypt the next morning.

One part of the lamb was for the passing over of God's judgement. And another part of the lamb was for nourishment, strengthening for the journey OUT of Egypt.

Christ is not only said to be our Passover lamb.
He is said to be our Passover - ie. each item involved in the Passover.

He was sacrificed for the believers. And His blood is significant and His roasted flesh for the meal is also very significant.

"...
for our Passover, Christ, also has been sacrificed for us." (1 Cor. 5:7)

You need experience in believing into Jesus and receiving Jesus. And taking the living Jesus Christ into your innermost spiritual being, you need ThinkOfOne.

Originally posted by @romans1009
It’s not proclaiming faith with the mouth. It’s about believing in Christ in one’s heart.

I would wager there are scores of people who say they are Christians and go to church every Sunday but who are not saved because they don’t believe in Christ in their hearts.

So there is proclamation with the mouth.
There is believing in ones heart.

Can you explain the difference?

Originally posted by @sonship
... And taking the living Jesus Christ into your innermost spiritual being, ....

How exactly do you do that?

Talking
Thinking
Feeling

What exactly?

Originally posted by @rajk999
So there is proclamation with the mouth.
There is believing in ones heart.

Can you explain the difference?

I have many times...

Believing in one’s heart means a sincere, committed, self-sacrificing belief.

A proclamation with the mouth, imo, doesn’t necessarily reflect that.

However, 1 Corinthians includes an interesting verse that speaks on this, though I’m not aware if it’s ever been tested.

“Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.”

(1 Corinthians 12:3)

Originally posted by @romans1009
I have many times...

Believing in one’s heart means a sincere, committed, self-sacrificing belief.

A proclamation with the mouth, imo, doesn’t necessarily reflect that.

However, 1 Corinthians includes an interesting verse that speaks on this, though I’m not aware if it’s ever been tested.

“Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speak ...[text shortened]... and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.”

(1 Corinthians 12:3)

No actually you still have not explained the difference:
What is .. a sincere, committed, self-sacrificing belief.

Originally posted by @rajk999
No actually you still have not explained the difference:
What is .. a sincere, committed, self-sacrificing belief.

A commitment to follow Christ. A commitment to remain faithful to Christ. A commitment to endure persecutions and hardships for Christ. A commitment to live in the Spirit as best as one can through reading the Bible and prayer because when one lives in the Spirit, he or she does not, as Paul phrases it in Galatians, “fulfil the lusts of the flesh.”

“For to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.”

(Romans 8:6)

Originally posted by @rajk999
No actually you still have not explained the difference:
What is .. a sincere, committed, self-sacrificing belief.

“And he said to them all, If any man will come after me, let him deny himself, and take up his cross daily, and follow me.”

(Luke 9:23)

Originally posted by @romans1009
A commitment to follow Christ. A commitment to remain faithful to Christ. A commitment to endure persecutions and hardships for Christ. A commitment to live in the Spirit as best as one can through reading the Bible and prayer because when one lives in the Spirit, he or she does not, as Paul phrases it in Galatians, “fulfil the lusts of the flesh.”

“F ...[text shortened]... to be carnally minded is death; but to be spiritually minded is life and peace.”

(Romans 8:6)

Read your bible and pray.

Is that it what ..... a sincere, committed, self-sacrificing belief. is all about?

OK .. I think you tried your best to explain.

I got it now.