22 Nov 05
Originally posted by blindfaith101HOW was Abraham talking to the Rich Man in Hell (NOT HIS GRAVE) if Abraham was "dead in his grave" and his "spirit was asleep"? Just answer that question, blindfaith.
JESUS wa right, HE never once stated they were in heaven.
Also your body is dead in your grave. Your spirit is asleep. Waiting for the call of JESUS CHRIST.
22 Nov 05
2 edits
Matthew 22:
31 And as for the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was said to you by God,
32 'I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'? He is God not of the dead, but of
the living."
EDIT: He is "the God of Abraham;" he is God "not of the dead." No.1 is right...
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22 Nov 05
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Originally posted by vistesdIn Matthew 22:32, Jesus said that “God is not the God of the dead but of the living.” Some teach that this verse means that there are really no dead as far as God is concerned. The text more accurately reads, “God is not the God of dead people, but of living people.” The bible says, “dead people” will become “living people” only when Jesus Christ comes to resurrect them.
Matthew 22:
31 And as for the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was said to you by God,
32 'I am the God of Abraham, the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob'? He is God not of the dead, but of
the living."
EDIT: He is "the God of Abraham;" he is God "not of the dead." No.1 is right...
In fact, the context surrounding this verse emphasizes the resurrection (see verses 23,28,30)
Matthew 22:31 and 32
(31) But as touching the RESURRECTION of the dead, have ye not read that which was spoken unto you by God, saying,
(32) I am the God of Abraham, and the God of Isaac, and the God of Jacob? God is not the God of the dead, but of the living.
God is not the God of dead people, because as Psalm 115:17 indicates, the dead cannot praise God, and Ecclesiastes showed that the dead cannot do anything for Him. They are, however, still in the mind of God, and at the resurrection, they will be made living people again, and He will again be their God.
Two verses in Romans go hand-in-hand with Matthew 22:32, and also indicate that it is the Lord Jesus Christ Who will raise the dead.
Romans 14:8 and 9
(8) For whether we live, we live unto the Lord; and whether we die, we die unto the Lord: whether we live therefore, or die, we are the Lord’s.
(9) For to this end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
22 Nov 05
Originally posted by checkbaiterAs usual, Jesus says something very clearly, but because Romans says something differently, you clowns take Paul's words as definitive and change Jesus' clear meaning to conform to Paul. What a strange group of "Christians"!
In Matthew 22:32, Jesus said that “God is not the God of the dead but of the living.” Some teach that this verse means that there are really no dead as far as God is concerned. The text more accurately reads, “God is not the God of dead people, but of living people.” The bible says, “dead people” will become “living people” only when Jesus Christ comes t ...[text shortened]... end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
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22 Nov 05
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Originally posted by no1marauderEven so, you are denying the context of what Jesus was saying in verses 23,28 and 30. It was the ressurection.
As usual, Jesus says something very clearly, but because Romans says something differently, you clowns take Paul's words as definitive and change Jesus' clear meaning to conform to Paul. What a strange group of "Christians"!
Not to mention the Psalms.🙂
22 Nov 05
Originally posted by checkbaiterI guess I would have to go with the first interpretation, because of the connection in the verse between the God “of Abraham,” etc., with the God of the living (or living people). The Hebrew Scriptures, I think, have differing views depending on the writer—but I’d have to research that some more…
In Matthew 22:32, Jesus said that “God is not the God of the dead but of the living.” Some teach that this verse means that there are really no dead as far as God is concerned. The text more accurately reads, “God is not the God of dead people, but of living people.” The bible says, “dead people” will become “living people” only when Jesus Christ comes t ...[text shortened]... end Christ both died, and rose, and revived, that he might be Lord both of the dead and living.
22 Nov 05
Originally posted by checkbaiterReally?? Where does Jesus use the word "resurrection" in reference to anybody but himself? Where does he say that people are "dead in their grave" until the Resurrection?
Even so, you are denying the context of what Jesus was saying in verses 23,28 and 30. It was the ressurection.
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22 Nov 05
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Originally posted by no1marauderMatt 22:29-30
Really?? Where does Jesus use the word "resurrection" in reference to anybody but himself? Where does he say that people are "dead in their grave" until the Resurrection?
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God.
30 "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.
(NKJ)
Matt 22:31
31 "But concerning the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God, saying,
(NKJ)
22 Nov 05
Originally posted by checkbaiterAgain, given the present tense (in the Greek too) I will still go with the first interpretation...
Matt 22:29-30
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God.
30 "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.
(NKJ)
Matt 22:31
31 "But concerning the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God, saying,
(NKJ)
22 Nov 05
Originally posted by checkbaiterJohn 11: 25-26: 25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth on me, though he die, yet shall he live;
Matt 22:29-30
29 Jesus answered and said to them, "You are mistaken, not knowing the Scriptures nor the power of God.
30 "For in the resurrection they neither marry nor are given in marriage, but are like angels of God in heaven.
(NKJ)
Matt 22:31
31 "But concerning the resurrection of the dead, have you not read what was spoken to you by God, saying,
(NKJ)
26 and whosoever liveth and believeth on me shall never die.
"Shall NEVER die". That seems to say that immediately after death the righteous go to Heaven, doesn't it??
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22 Nov 05
Originally posted by vistesdFYI...Check these as well .
I guess I would have to go with the first interpretation, because of the connection in the verse between the God “of Abraham,” etc., with the God of the living (or living people). The Hebrew Scriptures, I think, have differing views depending on the writer—but I’d have to research that some more…
Ps 88:10
10 Will You work wonders for the dead? Shall the dead arise and praise You? Selah
(NKJ)
Ps 115:17
17 The dead do not praise the LORD, nor any who go down into silence.
(NKJ)
Eccl 9:5-7
5 For the living know that they will die; but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of them is forgotten.
6 Also their love, their hatred, and their envy have now perished; Nevermore will they have a share in anything done under the sun.
7 Go, eat your bread with joy, and drink your wine with a merry heart; for God has already accepted your works.
(NKJ)
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22 Nov 05
Originally posted by no1marauder"He shall live" when?..at the ressurection.
John 11: 25-26: 25 Jesus said unto her, I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth on me, though he die, yet shall he live;
26 and whosoever liveth and believeth on me shall never die.
"Shall NEVER die". That seems to say that immediately after death the righteous go to Heaven, doesn't it??
22 Nov 05
Originally posted by checkbaiterGuess Jesus was wrong again in John 11:25-26. It's not his day; you, blindfaith and RBHILL have all caught him in screwups.
FYI...Check these as well .
Ps 88:10
10 Will You work wonders for the dead? Shall the dead arise and praise You? Selah
(NKJ)
Ps 115:17
17 The dead do not praise the LORD, nor any who go down into silence.
(NKJ)
Eccl 9:5-7
5 For the living know that they will die; but the dead know nothing, and they have no more reward, for the memory of the ...[text shortened]... ith joy, and drink your wine with a merry heart; for God has already accepted your works.
(NKJ)
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22 Nov 05
Originally posted by no1marauderJohn 11:25 and 26a
What does the word "NEVER" mean to you??
(25) Jesus said unto her [Lazarus’ sister Martha], I am the resurrection, and the life: he that believeth in Me, though he were dead, yet shall he live:
(26) And whosoever liveth and believeth in Me shall never die.
Verse 26a is sometimes wrenched out of its context to show that no one who believes in Jesus Christ really dies. But verse 25 contains the key word to understanding verse 26: “resurrection.” Jesus knew that, like all those in the Bible who were raised from the dead, Lazarus would die again. He makes it clear that in the future “he shall live.” Thus whosoever lives and believes in Christ will never die after the resurrection.