Criminal or Insane

Originally posted by jaywill
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Of course not. But it does prove Christians don't have their act together.
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I agree with you that it does not prove that God does not exist.

When Jesus was asked specifically about the work of God He replied what was the basic work of God:

"Then they said to Him, ...[text shortened]... d that work in [b]John 6:29 ?

If I believe in Christ am I doing what Jesus said ?[/b]

You are doing some of what he says. You are like a student who goes to school, but never does any school work. You flunk the exam!

Originally posted by 667joe
You are doing some of what he says. You are like a student who goes to school, but never does any school work. You flunk the exam!

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You are doing some of what he says. You are like a student who goes to school, but never does any school work. You flunk the exam!
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Good enough. I'll take that.

Now going back to what you wrote before about giving up one's possessions.

Which do you think would constitute what Jesus said, if we combined the two axioms ?

1.) Not believing that God sent the Son Jesus Christ, and giving my possessions away.

2.) Believing that God sent the Son Jesus Christ, and giving my possessions away.

Which of these two would be more acting according to what He said ?

(We may discuss "final exam" latter)

Originally posted by jaywill
[b]===========================================
You are doing some of what he says. You are like a student who goes to school, but never does any school work. You flunk the exam!
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Good enough. I'll take that.

Now going back to what you wrote before about giving up one's possessions.

Which do yo ...[text shortened]... e more acting according to what He said ?

(We may discuss "final exam" latter)[/b]

If you are a Christian, you should do the latter. Either way, you are insane unless you are about to die in which case you will shortly not need your possesions.

Originally posted by 667joe
If you are a Christian, you should do the latter. Either way, you are insane unless you are about to die in which case you will shortly not need your possesions.

I didn't ask you which should a Christian do.
I asked which was more doing what Jesus said.

Originally posted by 667joe
Let's face it, nobody lives the way the bible says.

prove it.

Originally posted by PsychoPawn
Including the old testament?

observance of the new testament fulfills the old testament. You would know that if you bothered to read the bible for yourself instead of letting Dawkins do it for you.

Originally posted by Doward
observance of the new testament fulfills the old testament. You would know that if you bothered to read the bible for yourself instead of letting Dawkins do it for you.

Wow... maybe you should resist getting defensive against people you don't know anything about.

I never let Dawkins do anything for me... but of course, you just assumed that because you're talking out of your arse.

I am aware of the arguments that the new testament somehow "fulfills" the old testament - whatever that really means and hence christians don't have to follow those rules. Of course, they still use the old testament rules to justify their beliefs at times - but they somehow don't apply.

Why don't you stop assuming you know anything about what I actually think?

Originally posted by Doward
prove it.

He thinks we're insane. I'm not sure what profit there is in having a discussion with someone who thinks you are insane. It seems to be his obsession to insist so.

Originally posted by Doward
prove it.

Tell us one, one is enough, who lives like Jesus did, and I will admit that 667joe is wrong.

Originally posted by jaywill
He thinks we're insane. I'm not sure what profit there is in having a discussion with someone who thinks you are insane. It seems to be his obsession to insist so.

"If a man would follow, today, the teachings of the Old Testament he would be a criminal. If he would strictly follow the teachings of the New, he would be insane. Robert Ingersoll"

The one thinking that all Christians strictly follow the teachings of the New Testament really is insane. I don't really think any Christian really think that. Do you?

Originally posted by FabianFnas
"If a man would follow, today, the teachings of the Old Testament he would be a criminal. If he would strictly follow the teachings of the New, he would be insane. Robert Ingersoll"

The one thinking that all Christians strictly follow the teachings of the New Testament really is insane. I don't really think any Christian really think that. Do you?

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The one thinking that all Christians strictly follow the teachings of the New Testament really is insane. I don't really think any Christian really think that. Do you?
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If I wrote you a somewhat more detailed response could you read it ?

I would like to show you from Paul's writing his attitude about how he measured up to following the New Testament teaching.

I would like to use Paul because I think he is a model for all Christians to see the normal Christian life and attitude.

Would you read my response if it is in one post ?

Okay, what should be a normal healthy attitude of a Christian concerning how she or he measures up to strictly following the New Testament ?

Paul in the middle part of his life wrote this:

"Not that I have already obtained or am already perfected, but I pursue, if even I may lay hold of that for which I also have been laid hold of by Christ Jesus. Brothers, I do not account myself to have laid hold; but one thing I do: Forgetting the things which are behind and streteching forward to the things which are before,

I pursue towards the goal for the prize to which God in Christ Jesus has called me upward." (Phillippians 3:12-14)

Paul did not consider that he had "arrived" at Christian perfection. This is Paul speaking. He is still pursuing to live the high Christian life. He is still a LEARNER, one developing, one growing, one learning to be more obediant.

One thing he does do. He forgets the past. Yesterday is under the blood of Jesus. Yesterday is gone. Today is a new day. He forgets the things of the past, whether successes or failures. That is under the blood of Jesus. That is gone in the past and today is a new opportunity.

Today is all he has. He cannot live in the past. Today he still stretches forth, still pursues, still seeks to grow and attain to the high calling that God has called him to.

Paul says "Let us therefore, as many as are fullgrown, have this mind ..." (v. 15a)

In other words Paul accounts maturity to have this kind of attitude. If you are mature, let the past go. Keep pursuing the high calling today. That is to be full grown. It is not to make no more mistakes or never fall into any sins. It is to let the past go and continue to keep on keeping on.

Now let us look not at the middle of Paul's Christian life but at his end. Here his attitude is somewhat different:

"I have fought the good fight; I have finished the course; I have kept the faith.

Henceforth there is laid up for me the crown of righteousness, with which the Lord, the righteous Judge, will recompense me in that day, and not only me but also all those who have loved His appearing." (2 Timothy 4:7,8)

This now shortly before Paul's martyrdom. Now he says he has finished his course. Like a long distance runner, he has completed his course. He has not loss faith for any reason. He has fought long and overcome. He has won his Christian fight. He has kept the faith to the end and is ready to meet his Lord.

Paul expects to be awarded by Jesus with a "crown of righteousness". This is not a crown of mercy, though God is merciful. This is not a crown of grace. This is a crown of RIGHTEOUSNESS. That is a reward for righteous living.

The awarder of this reward he expects is "the Righteous Judge". Paul does not say he expects a reward from the gracious Savior, or the merciful Friend of Sinners. It is "the Righteous Judge" who Paul expects to grant to him. That is a reward of a "crown of RIGHTEOUSNESS".

God is a God of mercy, no doubt. But here Paul is talking about a reward he is sure he will receive because of RIGHTEOUS practical service and living as a Christian.

Can you see the difference ? At first we see Paul saying that he does not consider himself to have arrived at perfection. But he keeps on keeping on. Now at the end of his Christian journey he really expects that a "crown of righteousness" awarded by "the Righteous Judge" awaits him.

He has confidence.

I think this is the proper attitude all Christians should have. We only have today. Yesterday is gone and under the precious blood of Jesus. We stretch forward and keep running our Christian race to the end.


At the end of our lives, if we are conscious, hopefull we may have peace to say that we know that we have kept the faith, run the race, fought the good fight, and expect that our righteous living will be approved and rewarded by the Lord Jesus.

WE love His appearing. We do not shun it or shrink from it. We LOVE His appearing and that we are about to stand before this Son of God face to face.

Amen.

The condensed version:

Now if all that is too verbose, our proper Christian attitude is something like what Yogi Berra said - "It ain't over til its over."

Originally posted by PsychoPawn
Wow... maybe you should resist getting defensive against people you don't know anything about.

I never let Dawkins do anything for me... but of course, you just assumed that because you're talking out of your arse.

I am aware of the arguments that the new testament somehow "fulfills" the old testament - whatever that really means and hence christi ...[text shortened]... n't apply.

Why don't you stop assuming you know anything about what I actually think?

actually you are sounding defensive, and rightfully so. You made the implication about the old testament, I merely responded with accurate information, and a likely astute observation about your point of view. I think I hit the nail on the head.

Originally posted by FabianFnas
Tell us one, one is enough, who lives like Jesus did, and I will admit that 667joe is wrong.

the burden of proof is not on us, or me, it is on him. He made an accusation, he should be prepared to support it.