Dive is a fake Christian

@kellyjay said
Well the book of Hebrews has some very bad news for you if God actually was in you. That would mean it is going to be impossible for you to recover, your fate is sealed. I tend to doubt that with you since you deny God as being real. If the Lord was in you, you’d know it and wouldn’t deny Him as real, even if you are not following Him.

Talking to me as if were still a Christian makes you sound foolish. Why would what you believe is "bad news" in "the book of Hebrews" mean anything to me? It's kind of funny. It's as if you just don't understand what loss of faith means.

@kellyjay said
Well the book of Hebrews has some very bad news for you if God actually was in you. That would mean it is going to be impossible for you to recover, your fate is sealed. I tend to doubt that with you since you deny God as being real. If the Lord was in you, you’d know it and wouldn’t deny Him as real, even if you are not following Him.

And there's you ~ someone who - according to your own logic - does not know whether he is "pretending to be a Christian" or not and does not know whether or not he has been pretending to be one for decades ~ there's you, reciting Christian dogma and intoning grim threats regardless.

@kellyjay said
Well the book of Hebrews has some very bad news for you if God actually was in you. That would mean it is going to be impossible for you to recover, your fate is sealed. I tend to doubt that with you since you deny God as being real. If the Lord was in you, you’d know it and wouldn’t deny Him as real, even if you are not following Him.

But Kelly, you replied 'very true' to the statement that,'the comfort is that Jesus will never stop caring for us even if we turn our backs on Him.'

How can that be 'very true' if there is no way back after walking away from God? How is that logical if Jesus never stops caring for us?

Is God saying "Turn your back on me and I'll still care for you, right up until the point I burn you in hell for all eternity"?

@ghost-of-a-duke said
But Kelly, you replied 'very true' to the statement that,'the comfort is that Jesus will never stop caring for us even if we turn our backs on Him.'

How can that be 'very true' if there is no way back after walking away from God? How is that logical if Jesus never stops caring for us?

Is God saying "Turn your back on me and I'll still care for you, right up until the point I burn you in hell for all eternity"?

This requires a more detailed answer than I can give now. There is a point of no return the sinner who chooses sin over God will be granted his wish. If you are going to expore this, read the book of Hebrews it is not that large!

@fmf said
And there's you ~ someone who - according to your own logic - does not know whether he is "pretending to be a Christian" or not and does not know whether or not he has been pretending to be one for decades ~ there's you, reciting Christian dogma and intoning grim threats regardless.

I have no doubt so do not assume you know what I or other believers have, you obviously have never experienced the Spirit of God or you could not be an Atheist.

@kellyjay said
I have no doubt so do not assume you know what I or other believers have, you obviously have never experienced the Spirit of God or you could not be an Atheist.

I had "no doubt" for 25+ years. The reason we don't know if you are "pretending to be a Christian" is because of your reasoning as demonstrated in this thread, not because of there being "no doubt" or not. We do not and cannot know yet whether you will be an atheist one day. Your logic. Not mine.

@kellyjay said
you obviously have never experienced the Spirit of God or you could not be an Atheist.

You have simply "experienced" having certain beliefs; nothing supernatural has happened to you. There is no reason to believe that my beliefs were any stronger or weaker when I was a Christian than yours are now.

@kellyjay said
I have no doubt so do not assume you know what I or other believers have, you obviously have never experienced the Spirit of God or you could not be an Atheist.

I think that is your argument (struggle) in a nutshell. Anyone who experiences the spirit of God wouldn't be able to walk away.

Problem is Kelly, many genuine Christians have had cause to abandon their faith. I appreciate that raises issues for you, but that doesn't make it any less true. It does also raise the question 'what if' some life event caused you personally to lose your faith. Would that render your previous belief in God one of fakery?

@kellyjay said
This requires a more detailed answer than I can give now. There is a point of no return the sinner who chooses sin over God will be granted his wish. If you are going to expore this, read the book of Hebrews it is not that large!

The reason you “require more time” is that you are talking complete made up bollox.

@divegeester said
The reason you “require more time” is that you are talking complete made up bollox.

Keep in mind that KJ takes all scripture literally. As such, typing out detailed answers is difficult for him.

Matthew 5
30 And if your right hand causes you to sin, cut it off and throw it away...

@ghost-of-a-duke said
I think that is your argument (struggle) in a nutshell. Anyone who experiences the spirit of God wouldn't be able to walk away.

Problem is Kelly, many genuine Christians have had cause to abandon their faith. I appreciate that raises issues for you, but that doesn't make it any less true. It does also raise the question 'what if' some life event caused you personally to lose your faith. Would that render your previous belief in God one of fakery?

The seed and the sower talks about that, Jesus also makes it clear if we put anything before God we are not worthy, and this would include family, friends, things, positions, power, wealth, and so on. We are not doing God a favor coming to Him, its His grace and mercy we are not worthy of.

They may without a doubt walk away, otherwise there would be no need for the warning. Count the cost! If anyone experiences God and walks away there is grace, but if they are turned completely to sin after Jesus grace and the in filling of the Spirit in their lives, all hope for them is gone. God’s salvation is incredibly great, treating with distain can put you in a position before God no one and nothing can save you from.

@fmf said
You have simply "experienced" having certain beliefs; nothing supernatural has happened to you. There is no reason to believe that my beliefs were any stronger or weaker when I was a Christian than yours are now.

You keep saying nothing supernatural happen to me as if you know. He saved my soul, my life, all there is about me. You have no stinking idea what I was like before, I most certainly wasn’t raised Christian far from it. What my life was like before was altered by Him, not a church because I didn’t attend any the first few years of my walk with Lord. I didn’t even get saved in a church!

@kellyjay said
You keep saying nothing supernatural happen to me as if you know.

Yes, I do know. I know full well that it's a part of your ideology to believe that something supernatural has happened to you and that, as a result, you believe that you have access to 'special knowledge' that non-believers do not.

@kellyjay said
You keep saying nothing supernatural happen to me as if you know. He saved my soul, my life, all there is about me. You have no stinking idea what I was like before, I most certainly wasn’t raised Christian far from it. What my life was like before was altered by Him, not a church because I didn’t attend any the first few years of my walk with Lord. I didn’t even get saved in a church!

Religious beliefs - regardless of which religion happen to underpin them - play a role in turning people's lives around all the time. Good for you for turning your life around. Just because your religious belief hepled you do it does not mean there was a supernatural process.

@kellyjay said
They may without a doubt walk away, otherwise there would be no need for the warning. Count the cost! If anyone experiences God and walks away there is grace, but if they are turned completely to sin after Jesus grace and the in filling of the Spirit in their lives, all hope for them is gone.

What "need" for a warning? There is no "need" for a warning.

Can you really not conceive of what disbelief and lack of belief actually mean?

There is no "need" for religious warnings and threats against non-believers. It's nonsensical. They are just clumsy bits of confirmation bias for believers to whom those warnings and threats do not apply.

The idea that there is somehow a "need" for such warnings and threats specifically against people who do not believe they are real is an idea that could have been one of the riffs in Joseph Heller's "Catch 22".

The reason you subscribe to such convoluted "logic" is psychological and not supernatural.