Originally posted by robbie carrobieso an atheist who helps people overcome their problems will prove the validity of atheism or are you prepared to confess to being a hypocrite?
I think it does FMF, sorry, it makes our teachings very valid,
(2 Timothy 3:14-15) . . .You, however, continue in the things that you learned and
were persuaded to believe, knowing from what persons you learned them and that
from infancy you have known the holy writings, [b]which are able to make you wise
for salvation through the fait ...[text shortened]... why this is not
the course of wisdom and why it does not validate our teaching, if you please.[/b]
Originally posted by robbie carrobieI know you think it validates your theories and assertions about God and the bible but it only does in so much as it convinces you that you are right about what you think. It does not have any objective meaning or "validity" that affects me and others.
I think it does FMF, sorry, it makes our teachings very valid,
However, there are all manner of people with all manner of theories about our existence etc. who demonstrate "wisdom" and who are philanthropic and empathetic towards others and do 'good works' similar to those you say you personally do, and yet none of this is based on the same speculation you do about supernatural things. This fact means that such activity no more "validates" the religionist ideology that underpins their behaviour and actions, than it does yours.
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-Removed-(Revelation 2:6) . . .Still, you do have this, that you hate the deeds of the sect of Nicolaus, which I also hate. . .
(Romans 12:9) . . .Let your love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is wicked, cling to what is good. . .
(Matthew 18:6) But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who put faith in me, it
is more beneficial for him to have hung around his neck a millstone such as is
turned by an ass and to be sunk in the wide, open sea.
you might do a whole lot better if you actually attempted to discern the scriptural
precedent for such statements, as it stands you FAIL to do so and are left
floundering in the view of such self evident scriptural references.
Originally posted by robbie carrobieSo you personally endorse the words in Watchtower Oct 1, 1952, Page 599 par 11 - 13?
you might do a whole lot better if you actually attempted to discern the scriptural precedent for such statements, as it stands you FAIL to do so and are left floundering in the view of such self evident scriptural references.
Originally posted by FMFYour statement is simply untenable, the works themselves validate the teaching,
I know you think it validates your theories and assertions about God and the bible but it only does in so much as it convinces you that you are right about what you think. It does not have any objective meaning or "validity" that affects me and others.
However, there are all manner of people with all manner of theories about our existence etc. who demonstrat ...[text shortened]... the religionist ideology that underpins their behaviour and actions, than it does yours.
irrespective of whether they affect you or not, for they are helping others who are
applying the knowledge in a great way. To state that because they have no potency
because you have no interest in applying them is not a sound argument against their
validity is it, its akin to saying that opiates have no potency because i dont take drugs.
No one demonstrates knowledge that is able to make a person wise for salvation
though, do they? This is something quite different from philanthropic 'good works'.
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-Removed-and what about these verses, you have not mentioned anything, why not?
(Revelation 2:6) . . .Still, you do have this, that you hate the deeds of the sect of Nicolaus, which I also hate. . .
(Romans 12:9) . . .Let your love be without hypocrisy. Abhor what is wicked, cling to what is good. . .
(Matthew 18:6) But whoever stumbles one of these little ones who put faith in me, it
is more beneficial for him to have hung around his neck a millstone such as is
turned by an ass and to be sunk in the wide, open sea.
did we make them up?
Of course you dont, you have the namby pamby one dimensional view that Christ is
all fluff and cotton wool, when in fact, scriptures indicate that he is a King who will
enact vengeance, is it any wonder your point of view is biased?
Originally posted by robbie carrobieThe fact that you assert that your acts lead to salvation and are "certified" in some way, has no objective aspect at all. It is simply something that you are telling yourself and you are convinced it is true. Once again, hundreds of millions of people "help others" as an extension of their faith or some other dimension of their spirit or spiritual self, without being Jehovah's Witnesses. Nothing you have ever said on this forum has ever demonstrated that you have "knowledge that is able to make a person wise for salvation". Not even once. All you have demonstrated is that you claim to have such knowledge.
Your statement is simply untenable, the works themselves validate the teaching,
irrespective of whether they affect you or not, for they are helping others who are
applying the knowledge in a great way. To state that because they have no potency
because you have no interest in applying them is not a sound argument against their
validity is i ...[text shortened]... lvation
though, do they? This is something quite different from philanthropic 'good works'.
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-Removed-yes this is fine, and we have also adopted this point of view for it is understood that we
are under duress to demonstrate love to all sorts of persons. I cannot explain the
watchtower article, perhaps its a mistake, its not considered to be inspired and our
teaching may have undergone revision, after all, its almost seventy years ago and
without the whole article it would be impossible for me to comment upon it, after all,
you have only partially quoted it, haven't you.
Originally posted by FMFyou are not getting this FMF, i am stating that the works themselves, not that our acts
The fact that you assert that your acts lead to salvation and are "certified" in some way, has no objective aspect at all. It is simply something that you are telling yourself and you are convinced it is true. Once again, hundreds of millions of people "help others" as an extension of their faith or some other dimension of their spirit or spiritual self, without ...[text shortened]... tion". Not even once. All you have demonstrated is that you claim to have such knowledge.
are validation of our teaching, look, you are arguing against helping people seek
freedom from vice, why is that? If our teaching really is setting people free from vice
then its a validation in itself which you cannot deny. If people are coming to an
accurate knowledge of truth in connection with Jesus Christ then you cannot state with
any certainty that they are not being made wise for salvation , can you.
Originally posted by FMFOh dear it seems that our friend is rather fond, like all apostates of taking things out of
A few minutes ago, when asked point blank, you said you personally endorsed the article.
context and trying to ascribe values to us on this basis, i do fully endorse the article
after actually having read the whole, something our friend could not do because as
usual he has lifted it from a hate site that he likes to frequent, oh dear, another hater
caught again, proffering up articles without actually taking the time to read the whole,
its what's termed, prejudice, I produce the whole below, demonstrating that our friend
had not read it.