Spirituality

Spirituality

  1. Joined
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    10 Sep '18 12:17
    There are times when I think that some or most of the Bible stories are just too far fetched to be really true.

    God is angry, jealous, and vengeful in the OT, regarding the humans that HE created.

    Having to sacrifice and kill a human (Jesus) to save mankind seems unreasonable at times, especially when this sacrifice will only benefit a small percentage. All of the 'unbelievers' go to the Lake of Fire.

    And prayer. It doesn't seem to work, or matter much.

    Believing in a Creator is much different than believing in the one(s) given us in the Bible.

    Just sharing, in a time of doubt.
  2. Standard memberKellyJay
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    10 Sep '18 12:34
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    There are times when I think that some or most of the Bible stories are just too far fetched to be really true.

    God is angry, jealous, and vengeful in the OT, regarding the humans that HE created.

    Having to sacrifice and kill a human (Jesus) to save mankind seems unreasonable at times, especially when this sacrifice will only benefit a small percentag ...[text shortened]... fferent than believing in the one(s) given us in the Bible.

    Just sharing, in a time of doubt.
    Couple of things first being there is God, there’s no difference between the God of the OT and NT. Second why would you believe in a god whose actions could all be explained away by natural occurrences? God chooses to act in ways that defy our logic many times by doing what we would call unnatural, like Jesus birth and coming back from the dead. Third when you pray are you being honest with God or attempting to get Him to jump through hoops for you?
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    10 Sep '18 12:46
    Originally posted by @kellyjay
    Couple of things first being there is God, there’s no difference between the God of the OT and NT. Second why would you believe in a god whose actions could all be explained away by natural occurrences? God chooses to act in ways that defy our logic many times by doing what we would call unnatural, like Jesus birth and coming back from the dead. Third when you pray are you being honest with God or attempting to get Him to jump through hoops for you?
    Most Christians and Catholics believe that Jesus is God, in some way. If that's true at all, then it's clear that Jesus is far different in character than that of God in the OT.

    It's strange that God would even put a demand on the human mind with such a thing as multiple Gods that we find with the Trinity, or Godhead.
  4. Standard memberKellyJay
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    10 Sep '18 12:55
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    Most Christians and Catholics believe that Jesus is God, in some way. If that's true at all, then it's clear that Jesus is far different in character than that of God in the OT.

    It's strange that God would even put a demand on the human mind with such a thing as multiple Gods that we find with the Trinity, or Godhead.
    I believe Jesus was, is, and always will be God. Also the whole of the OT was setup the way it was to highlight Jesus’ coming.
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    10 Sep '18 13:22
    Originally posted by @kellyjay
    I believe Jesus was, is, and always will be God. Also the whole of the OT was setup the way it was to highlight Jesus’ coming.
    If that's true, then Jesus destroyed the human race at the time of Noah. That action is quite different than "coming to save the world, not condemn it".
    Doesn't really make sense.
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    10 Sep '18 13:361 edit
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    Most Christians and Catholics believe that Jesus is God, in some way. If that's true at all, then it's clear that Jesus is far different in character than that of God in the OT.

    It's strange that God would even put a demand on the human mind with such a thing as multiple Gods that we find with the Trinity, or Godhead.
    The difference that you see is the ushering in of a new covenant to deal with sin.

    No longer must God destroy the sinner to destroy the sin. That is what the cross was for.

    Jesus said that he did not come into the world to destroy the law, but to perfect it.

    That is what he did.

    If there was no difference, then no real change would have been ushered in.
  7. SubscriberFMF
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    10 Sep '18 13:482 edits
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    Doesn't really make sense.
    The people creating the breakaway religion felt the need to appropriate the Hebrew Bible and add their own personality cult stuff to it - after their 'King of the Jews' was executed for sedition - even though the Jews thought Jesus was a fake. These new religionists needed, wanted, fancied an obviouly different god figure. No wonder the supposed "continuity" is so contrived and convoluted. Then throw in the ludicrous book of Revelation for good measure to obfuscate and paper over the cracks with loads of opaque and demented dogma.
  8. Standard memberKellyJay
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    10 Sep '18 14:25
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    If that's true, then Jesus destroyed the human race at the time of Noah. That action is quite different than "coming to save the world, not condemn it".
    Doesn't really make sense.
    Several things were done in scripture between God and His creation. We were innocent with but one command and we failed. There was a time before the law and things got so bad our hearts were continually evil then the flood. God selected Abraham then through Him a people who were given a law, they failed. Then through that people Jesus came and saved us through His sacrifice, not relying on us because we have never been able to get it right.

    He didn’t come to condemn it but many will be, because they are not believing on Christ, so they stand condemned already.
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    10 Sep '18 15:431 edit
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    If that's true, then Jesus destroyed the human race at the time of Noah. That action is quite different than "coming to save the world, not condemn it".
    Doesn't really make sense.
    "In the teachings of Christ, religion is completely present tense: Jesus is the prototype and our task is to imitate him, become a disciple. But then through Paul came a basic alteration. Paul draws attention away from imitating Christ and fixes attention on the death of Christ The Atoner. What Martin Luther. in his reformation, failed to realize is that even before Catholicism, Christianity had become degenerate at the hands of Paul. Paul made Christianity the religion of Paul, not of Christ. Paul threw the Christianity of Christ away, completely turning it upside down. making it just the opposite of the original proclamation of Christ"

    --- Soren Kierkegaard, writing in The Journals

    So many buy into the "religion of Paul" because it so self-serving. The "religion of Paul" entails believing in a god that serves them.
  10. Standard memberKellyJay
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    10 Sep '18 17:24
    Originally posted by @thinkofone
    "In the teachings of Christ, religion is completely present tense: Jesus is the prototype and our task is to imitate him, become a disciple. But then through Paul came a basic alteration. Paul draws attention away from imitating Christ and fixes attention on the death of Christ The Atoner. What Martin Luther. in his reformation, failed to realize is that ...[text shortened]... because it so self-serving. The "religion of Paul" entails believing in a god that serves them.
    There’s no religion of Paul.
  11. Standard memberRajk999
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    10 Sep '18 17:381 edit
    Originally posted by @kellyjay
    There’s no religion of Paul.
    In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ according to my gospel.
    (Romans 2:16 KJV)
  12. Standard memberKellyJay
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    10 Sep '18 19:06
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    In the day when God shall judge the secrets of men by Jesus Christ [b]according to my gospel.
    (Romans 2:16 KJV)[/b]
    And
  13. Standard memberRajk999
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    10 Sep '18 19:26
    Originally posted by @kellyjay
    And
    He refers to the teachings of Christ as 'the Gospel of Christ' and his teachings as 'my gospel'. They are not necessarily the same.

    The assumption that many Christians make that Paul taught only was what Jesus told him is false. The bible says no such thing. In fact there are two occasions where Paul said that he got nothing from Christ pertaining to a particular matter or doctrine but he is still giving his opinion.
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    10 Sep '18 19:44
    Originally posted by @chaney3
    There are times when I think that some or most of the Bible stories are just too far fetched to be really true.

    God is angry, jealous, and vengeful in the OT, regarding the humans that HE created.

    Having to sacrifice and kill a human (Jesus) to save mankind seems unreasonable at times, especially when this sacrifice will only benefit a small percentag ...[text shortened]... fferent than believing in the one(s) given us in the Bible.

    Just sharing, in a time of doubt.
    Doug is normal; don’t let it put you off.
  15. Standard memberKellyJay
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    10 Sep '18 20:10
    Originally posted by @rajk999
    He refers to the teachings of Christ as 'the Gospel of Christ' and his teachings as 'my gospel'. They are not necessarily the same.

    The assumption that many Christians make that Paul taught only was what Jesus told him is false. The bible says no such thing. In fact there are two occasions where Paul said that he got nothing from Christ pertaining to a particular matter or doctrine but he is still giving his opinion.
    Like saying the Gospel of John, or according to John? There is no religion of John!
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