Originally posted by Bosse de NageI am in wholehearted agreement here.
Just for you:
"I have repeatedly said that in my opinion the idea of a personal God is a childlike one, but I do not share the crusading spirit of the professional atheist whose fervor is mostly due to a painful act of liberation from the fetters of religious indoctrination received in youth. I prefer an attitude of humility corresponding to the wea ...[text shortened]... t could cope with modern scientific needs it would be Buddhism. (Albert Einstein)"
I've been studying and undergoing training in Southeast Asian Buddhist "mindfulness" or Vipassna meditation.
Einstein, when he is said to have opined that "God does not play dice with the universe," meant, in my opinion, what Bosse de Nage has identified as Einstein's true spirituality.
To Einstein, the word God and Universe meant the same thing -- and he was able to withhold judgment or speculation or dogma about that which he did not and could not demonstrate he knew.
To me, one of the most important questions, spiritually, is "How to you know?"
The answer "Because," whether that is based on something written down in the past or on something one heard from another as a revelation from a supernatural source just can't cut it.
Originally posted by jaywillI'm ecstatic to be able to inform you that I am the very same Alexander Scriabin to whom you refer.
Scriabin !
Nice tag. One of my favorite composers. Any relation to Alexander Scriabin ?
I taught Vladimir Horowitz how to tickle the keys ...
I know, I know, you'll say I've been dead all this time --not true.
Yes, I was walled up for a long time. but I was busy with a lot of work on a lot of very bad music I had written and it took time to decide whether to rewrite or tear it all up.
I chose the latter and I've been decomposing ever since.
Originally posted by ScriabinYou are contradicting yourself there. When Einstein said "God does not play dice with the universe," he was expressing dogma, and he spent much of his life trying to reconcile that dogma with the conflicting evidence (dice).
Einstein, when he is said to have opined that "God does not play dice with the universe," meant, in my opinion, what Bosse de Nage has identified as Einstein's true spirituality.
To Einstein, the word God and Universe meant the same thing -- and he was able to withhold judgment or speculation or dogma about that which he did not and could not demonstrate he knew.
I also suspect that the use of the word 'God' for universe implies a belief that there is more to the universe than meets the eye - ie. speculation.
I think what lurks in your mind is similar to other non believers, not quite ready to discount evverything just in case the earth bound mega comet turns up.
Move along?, nah just can't be bothered to argue the case, I know what I believe and it's a belief shared by a lot smarter people than you and me.
Einstein was an Atheist! He says he just wasnt a "proffesional atheist" who wanted freedom from indocrination of childhood. He uses "God" to talk about the things we cant possibly understand due to our lack of intelligence. Not a Diety with a big stick to keep us in line, but nature's perfection. Look around. That's God, thats Einstein's "God". Thats why he agrees Buddhism makes the most sense. Buddhism concerns itself with harmony of the world. They don't call it a "god", but thats "God."
Originally posted by MrVarnellBudism no more along the lines of being a druid...
Einstein was an Atheist! He says he just wasnt a "proffesional atheist" who wanted freedom from indocrination of childhood. He uses "God" to talk about the things we cant possibly understand due to our lack of intelligence. Not a Diety with a big stick to keep us in line, but nature's perfection. Look around. That's God, thats Einstein's "God". Thats why h ...[text shortened]... rns itself with harmony of the world. They don't call it a "god", but thats "God."
Don't forget became a spituall person at the end of his life.
Al though he never where in your or my mening belived in A "god" his sience made look at the bigger picture in a way that you or yet alone anyone else can coprehend.
And that I think you can take to the "bank".
Originally posted by scottishinnzWell said! Few people could truthfully claim to really understand nor claim they would have thought of understand Relativity themselves without Einstein so anyone that calls Einstein a “dumb ass” is arrogant.
You think you could even understand Relativity, let alone come up with it?
I think I can clear this up: Einstein believed in God. Devoutly so. At the expense of his own standing in the scientific community. "Religious" is nebulous, so let's stick to the concrete. The man flatly said "God does not play dice." Just who do you think was the subject of his quote--Max Planck?
Einstein said:
# Science without religion is lame. Religion without science is blind.
# My religion consists of a humble admiration of the illimitable superior spirit who reveals himself in the slight details we are able to perceive with our frail and feeble mind.
# The further the spiritual evolution of mankind advances, the more certain it seems to me that the path to genuine religiosity does not lie through the fear of life, and the fear of death, and blind faith, but through striving after rational knowledge.
# Every one who is seriously involved in the pursuit of science becomes convinced that a spirit is manifest in the laws of the Universe-a spirit vastly superior to that of man, and one in the face of which we with our modest powers must feel humble.
# The scientists' religious feeling takes the form of a rapturous amazement at the harmony of natural law, which reveals an intelligence of such superiority that, compared with it, all the systematic thinking and acting of human beings is an utterly insignificant reflection.
# There is no logical way to the discovery of elemental laws. There is only the way of intuition, which is helped by a feeling for the order lying behind the appearance.
# The real problem is in the hearts and minds of men. It is easier to denature plutonium than to denature the evil spirit of man.
# True religion is real living; living with all one's soul, with all one's goodness and righteousness.
# Intelligence makes clear to us the interrelationship of means and ends. But mere thinking cannot give us a sense of the ultimate and fundamental ends. To make clear these fundamental ends and valuations and to set them fast in the emotional life of the individual, seems to me precisely the most important function which religion has to form in the social life of man.
Einstein also said:
A human being is a part of the whole, called by us Universe, a part limited in time and space. He experiences himself, his thoughts and feelings as something separated from the rest-a kind of optical delusion of his consciousness. This delusion is a kind of prison, restricting us to our personal desires and to affection for a few persons nearest to us. Our task must be to free from this prison by widening our circle of compassion to embrace all living creatures and the whole nature in its beauty.
The human mind is not capable of grasping the Universe. We are like a little child entering a huge library. The walls are covered to the ceilings with books in many different tongues. The child knows that someone must have written these books. It does not know who or how. It does not understand the languages in which they are written. But the child notes a definite plan in the arrangement of the books---a mysterious order which it does not comprehend, but only dimly suspects.
What I see in Nature is a magnificent structure that we can comprehend only very imperfectly, and that must fill a thinking person with a feeling of humility. This is a genuinely religious feeling that has nothing to do with mysticism.
Originally posted by twhiteheadI suspect and speculate that your mind is relatively speaking somewhat limited in scope.
You are contradicting yourself there. When Einstein said "God does not play dice with the universe," he was expressing dogma, and he spent much of his life trying to reconcile that dogma with the conflicting evidence (dice).
I also suspect that the use of the word 'God' for universe implies a belief that there is more to the universe than meets the eye - ie. speculation.
Oh, well, better living through denial.
In future, however, if I want your opinion, I'll ask you to fill out the necessary forms.
Originally posted by PinkFloydIf only it were that simple. Einstein did believe in god, but not god in the way of Judaism or Christianity.
I think I can clear this up: Einstein believed in God. Devoutly so. At the expense of his own standing in the scientific community. "Religious" is nebulous, so let's stick to the concrete. The man flatly said "God does not play dice." Just who do you think was the subject of his quote--Max Planck?
There's plenty of evidence that Einstein saw god as essentially a metaphor for all that was awe inspiring in the world, but didn't think of salvation.
The problem is that we'll never know now for sure no matter how much quote mining people do.