@sonship said

So the "nothing which they propose to do will be kept from them" I take as eventually nothing BUT the horrendously dystopian.

When you back up from Genesis 11 you see that Adam and Eve actually sabotaged the entire race by eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The first man was the corruptor of man by moving from his neutral position between God and Satan and siding with Satan.

This taking into himself the food of the forbidden tree brought sin and death as the Satanic nature into all the decedents of Adam and Eve. It is not simply that they disobeyed God, which they did of course. It is that a foreign element got into them.

That real sabotage of all humanity occurred when a pristinely smart, pristinely intelligent, superbly very good sentient being with freedom to choose, chose wrongly.

He chose wrongly against the clear warning of God that that choice would only cause him to die. Ever after whether he did according to knowledge of good or evil he was infested with Satan. Any endeavor the fallen man devoted to himself or themselves under this corruption could only eventually end in Satan's purposes being fulfilled.

Satan's purpose is and ever will be to destroy God's creation man through stealth, trickery, deception, false advertising.

@sonship said
When you back up from Genesis 11 you see that Adam and Eve actually sabotaged the entire race by eating of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. The first man was the corruptor of man by moving from his neutral position between God and Satan and siding with Satan.

@sonship

This is what gets my goat. (Figuratively speaking. Please don't take the goat thing literally). As a species, humanity has done incredibly well (by itself) to survive and flourish as it has done. 99% of all creatures who have ever lived are now extinct. But we're still here.

Why is that? Although we evolved into intelligent creatures who walked upright and had opposable thumbs (all very advantageous) it was our ability to cooperate that was our salvation. We learned to work together, hunt together, take on bigger prey. There was strength in numbers, we looked out for each other and formed crude basic morality. 'You don't kill me and I won't kill you. You don't take my stuff and I won't take yours.' - Over the centuries this morality grew more complex, enhanced by our increasing intelligence. - And this isn't speculation or belief. This is a factual explanation of the human journey.

But the thing that gets my goat is that you throw all of this human achievement and history out the window and say no, we started out in a garden and got in trouble for eating an apple.

If there was no first man and first woman, too much of the Bible collapses into meaninglessness.

When I first opened my heart to receive the Lord Jesus, the question of man origin was extremely important to me. I was like most others of my generation inundated with the thought that humans were evolved animals, blurring the distinction between us and other living things.

I admit that it took awhile. I am thankful that Christ did not demand of me to first accept all of Genesis's account of early man as a pre-requisite to salvation. I thank God for that very much. He did not ask other than I open my whole heart to the Lord Jesus and let Him enter into my life.

God did not demand first that I know the age of the earth.
He did not demand first that I know who Cain married.
He did not demand first that I figure out how animals lived in Noah's ark.

This nicely comes back to the OP. He caused me to stop for a moment my judging of everyone else and let the light of God shine solely on my own stained and soiled conscience.

But there was loving forgiveness that filled my heart which the world can never take away. No argument of ever take from me the deep sense inwardly of COMING HOME to my Father God. Even before I knew much about doctrines of Justification, Redemption, Reconciliation or knew anything about the book of Romans I knew I was at peace with God. He pardoned me. He received me.
He put me on the path to a brand new life.

Soon after I had come home to Jesus and to God I wandered down to a wetland pond near Princeton Junction New Jersey at dusk.
The twilight was setting. I heard some birds chirping. I hear some frogs. Instead of a gnawing loneliness I felt that deep inside I understood as never before. I thought -
"Now I understand. This is my Father's world. This is my Father's creation."

I had something now that I did not have before - that third dimension to human life. I had not just a soul and not just a body. I had now a regenerated innermost being - a human spirit. I had a reborn, born from above, born again spirit.. I had a spirit where the eternal Spirit bore witness that I was a child of God my Father.

Eventually latter the New Testament confirmed what I felt:
" The Spirit Himself witnesses with our spirit that we are children of God " (Rom. 8:16). Praise the Lord Jesus.

@sonship said
If there was no first man and first woman, too much of the Bible collapses into meaninglessness.

@ghost-of-a-duke said
True.

Two great significant men exist - the first man Adam and the last Adam.

Christ as the second man, the second Head of a new race of human beings is the last Adam. He concludes on the cross all the damage of the first Adam. And Christ the God-man transformed Himself in resurrection into a form in which He can combine with people.

"[T]he last Adam became a life giving Spirit" (1 Cor .15:45) .

The second man, the last Adam can bring Himself and God His Father into the innermost being of the man or woman who opens to receive Him. He can impart the divine and eternal life into man's being. This is true truth.

"But as many as received Him, to them He gave the authority to become children of God, to those who believe into His name,

Who were begotten not of blood,
nor of the will of the flesh,
nor of the will of man,
but of God." (John 1:12,13)

@sonship said

Satan's purpose is and ever will be to destroy God's creation man through stealth, trickery, deception, false advertising.

@Ghost-of-a-Duke

Why is that? Although we evolved into intelligent creatures who walked upright and had opposable thumbs (all very advantageous) it was our ability to cooperate that was our salvation. We learned to work together, hunt together, take on bigger prey. There was strength in numbers, we looked out for each other and formed crude basic morality. 'You don't kill me and I won't kill you. You don't take my stuff and I won't take yours.' - Over the centuries this morality grew more complex, enhanced by our increasing intelligence. - And this isn't speculation or belief. This is a factual explanation of the human journey.

8.7 million species
Scientists have recently estimated that there are approximately 8.7 million species on Earth. They believe that 1-2 million of those species are animals.

8.7 million species
Scientists have recently estimated that there are approximately 8.7 million species on Earth. They believe that 1-2 million of those species are animals.

I still want to know WHICH of these two is the better off if there is a last judgment:

==========================================
Back to the matter of Everyone who judges.

Compare two men:

1.) This man lived 3000 years ago. He has cheated on his wife and flirted with his neighbor's wife trying to steal away her devotion to her husband.

He doesn't know anything about the number of planets, the nature of stars, micro waves, black holes, gravity waves, the Higg's particle, or quantum entanglement.

2.) This man lives in 2021 AD (alright CE). He also is cheating on his wife. He also is committing adultery with another man's wife to the ruination of two families.

This guy knows all about quantum entanglement, the Higgs boson, microwave background radiation, the Big Bang, multi-verse theory, artificial Intelligence, and radiation therapy.

Which one of these two will be with better reasons to justify himself should he come before God in judgment for his sins? Why will one you choose be in a more advantageous position then the other?

If you two rapists. One born in the first century AD (CE) and the other in 2000.

The first thought the sun circles the earth, sperm is just a jelly like substance, the stars are set against a black solid dome in the sky, doesn't know what curved space / time is but knows he can fall off a cliff, knows about sunburn but not about ultra violet light or infra-red light, thinks garbage causes flies to be created.

The second rapist knows the earth goes around the sun, stars are huge gaseous disks billions of miles away, millions of sperm cells can potentially fertilize an egg, gravity is the effect of the curvature of space / time around mass, microscopic eggs from flies grow to be maggots and flies, understands why staying out in the sun light too long hurts his skin, and atoms are composed of neutrons, protons and electrons.

If these two rapists have to give an account for the women they forcefully violated leaving them pregnant and in misery, with haunting memories of violence, and possibly self hate - WHICH one of the rapists will be in a better situation because of his knowledge?

Which one will be more able to justify himself before God as to his crimes?