For ones interested in the Bible "only"...

Originally posted by galveston75
What do you consider the good parts? The thing ones misses by skipping around is the theme of the Bible and why all the scriptures are inspired. It's not different then skipping thru a best seller.. The Bible is full of principles that are lost if one doesn't read and get the meanings of them.

the problem with your statement is that one needs only to find an example to prove it wrong.

the bible contains some passage of such atrocious display of carnage by today's standards that they can be safely skipped without missing out on any "principles". do you agree with this statement?

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
Leviticus
20:9 “‘If anyone 17 curses his father and mother 18 he must be put to death. He has cursed his father and mother; his blood guilt is on himself. 19 20:10 If a man 20 commits adultery with his neighbor’s wife, 21 both the adulterer and the adulteress must be put to death. 20:11 If a man has sexual intercourse with his father’s wife, he has e ...[text shortened]... ostitute while living in her father’s house. In this way you will purge 37 evil from among you.

Soooo, what are you saying?

Originally posted by galveston75
What do you consider the good parts? The thing ones misses by skipping around is the theme of the Bible and why all the scriptures are inspired. It's not different then skipping thru a best seller.. The Bible is full of principles that are lost if one doesn't read and get the meanings of them.

Ah yeh, it's a little different from skipping through a best seller.
I would actually go out and spend money on a best seller. I wouldn't spend money on this set of books.
I understand what you're saying about missing important bits, but we're talking about chapters and chapters of rules and regulations for being a good Jew.
I'm not Jewish.

Originally posted by galveston75
Do you believe the Bible is the word of God? Again only for ones interested in the Bible.

Yes
Kelly

Originally posted by Zahlanzi
the problem with your statement is that one needs only to find an example to prove it wrong.

the bible contains some passage of such atrocious display of carnage by today's standards that they can be safely skipped without missing out on any "principles". do you agree with this statement?

By todays standards? What about justice and God's standards? Do you know why what you call atrocities were directed by God?

Originally posted by galveston75
By todays standards? What about justice and God's standards? Do you know why what you call atrocities were directed by God?

Because the Jews were the chosen ones and anyone else could be killed with impunity - mean, women and children.
There is no justification in the atrocities described in biblical stories. Oh yes, I know that god did it for their own good and all that, and to demonstrate his power and to give the Jewish people a chance to redeeem themselves and so on ...
If ever there was an argument for atheism, it surely must rest on the vile and contemptible approach to human life exhibited by this supernatural entity in these stories.

Originally posted by amannion
Ah yeh, it's a little different from skipping through a best seller.
I would actually go out and spend money on a best seller. I wouldn't spend money on this set of books.
I understand what you're saying about missing important bits, but we're talking about chapters and chapters of rules and regulations for being a good Jew.
I'm not Jewish.

But it is something that should be read once. This is how ones starts to get the personality of God and what he expects from humans. It also leads up to the point that we cannot direct our ways as humans without dire results and also leads to the fact that we needed the ransom of Jesus's life to make the future better for all humans.

Originally posted by Rajk999
You sound like a perfectionist Bible scholar. Whether or not there is any virtue in being such a person is open to discussion. But the Pharisees & Saducees were similar in nature and Christ had very little kind words for them. The reason simple .. the more you focus on the words and meaning and translations and accuracy of this version or that, the less you ...[text shortened]... of that message which brings virtue .. not the accurate evaluation of irrelevant Jewish history.

i see, unable to refute the reasoning, you resort to the now obligatory personal attack, how original.

firstly, Christ came to fulfil the law and the prophets, no relevance according to you, that would of course include the many messianic prophecy's, irrelevant according to you, that would of course include more than three quarters of the inspired words of Gods ancient servants, according to you, that would of course include the more than 300 Hebrew quotations in the Greek text, irrelevant according to you.

Secondly Christ stated, 'your word is truth', Gods word is truth, the Bible, which at the time of Christ was the law and the prophets, truth is therefore , irrelevant to you.

thirdly, Christ himself states at John ,chapter 3 verse 17, 'this means everlasting life their taking in knowledge of you and of the one whom you sent forth , Jesus Christ, knowledge is therefore secondary to the teaching of Christ, well not according to that scripture it isn't, for how does one take in knowledge without study?

fourthly, Paul statues, that 'all scripture is inspired of God, and is beneficial for teaching and reproving. He did not state that the new testament, or the gospels were, he stated that all scripture was. This is further compounded, by this verse,

(Romans 15:4-6) . . .For all the things that were written aforetime were written for our instruction, that through our endurance and through the comfort from the Scriptures we might have hope. Now may the God who supplies endurance and comfort grant you to have among yourselves the same mental attitude that Christ Jesus had, that with one accord you may with one mouth glorify the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ.

irrelevant you state, hardly irrelevant in view of the above, therefore while you may wish to languish in your superciliousness Raj, please dont try to slander others as a substitute for your own inadequacies.

Originally posted by amannion
Because the Jews were the chosen ones and anyone else could be killed with impunity - mean, women and children.
There is no justification in the atrocities described in biblical stories. Oh yes, I know that god did it for their own good and all that, and to demonstrate his power and to give the Jewish people a chance to redeeem themselves and so on ...
If ...[text shortened]... and contemptible approach to human life exhibited by this supernatural entity in these stories.

Well if ones believes in the Bible and it says God is the "giver of life" and the one that can "take it away", then the life we all have is a gift... God's immediate plan after Adam sinned was to restore what Adam lost for us all. So in a nut shell, God has the right to do what he feels is needed to get us to that point again. If that means protecting his people as was the case with the Isrealites from pagan attacks or threats, then he had the right to do that. Plus the Bible is very clear that there will be a resurrection of the righteous as well as the unrighteous. So those that died in the past from God's hand will have the chance to live again.
Again the earth belongs to God and all life on it. What we do with it is up to us but in the long run we have to appreciate and respect his gift. Unfortunently most on the earth don't.

Originally posted by galveston75
But it is something that should be read once. This is how ones starts to get the personality of God and what he expects from humans. It also leads up to the point that we cannot direct our ways as humans without dire results and also leads to the fact that we needed the ransom of Jesus's life to make the future better for all humans.

I thought god was unknowable. Now you're telling me that it's all here written down - jeez, why didn't anyone tell me that before?
On your second point, I have to tell you that this is one of the key bases for my own atheism. I absolutely reject the notion that there is something inherently bad or immature or wrong about us as humans. We can direct our lives and do it pretty well as many individuals and societies have shown over and over again.
I don't need to nail some bloke up on a cross, or worship the idea of that bloke, to know that I can make the future - my future, and my kids' future, and other people's future - a little bit better.
I am an autonomous human, not some robot ...

Originally posted by galveston75
Well if ones believes in the Bible and it says God is the "giver of life" and the one that can "take it away", then the life we all have is a gift... God's immediate plan after Adam sinned was to restore what Adam lost for us all. So in a nut shell, God has the right to do what he feels is needed to get us to that point again. If that means protecting hi ...[text shortened]... ng run we have to appreciate and respect his gift. Unfortunently most on the earth don't.

So everyone gets a second chance?
Oh well, that makes all the murder and genocide and infanticide and fratricide and everyoneyoucanthinkofcide okay.
I do agree with you on one point - the Earth, and our lives, is a 'gift'. But I use the term purely as a metaphor - I don't literally believe life or Earth was 'given' to me. I use the term because I believe that life is special and brief, and I believe I should do what I can to make it a good one for me and others.

Originally posted by amannion
I thought god was unknowable. Now you're telling me that it's all here written down - jeez, why didn't anyone tell me that before?
On your second point, I have to tell you that this is one of the key bases for my own atheism. I absolutely reject the notion that there is something inherently bad or immature or wrong about us as humans. We can direct our liv ...[text shortened]... other people's future - a little bit better.
I am an autonomous human, not some robot ...

Of course humans can decide to do what ever they want. God allows that by all means. We saw that with Adam and Eve didn't we?

Originally posted by galveston75
Of course humans can decide to do what ever they want. God allows that by all means. We saw that with Adam and Eve didn't we?

That's nice of god, allowing us to do whatever we want.
There's an overarching - and overbearing - language of paternalism when it comes to god and its relationship with us humans that I find particularly annoying.

Originally posted by amannion
So everyone gets a second chance?
Oh well, that makes all the murder and genocide and infanticide and fratricide and everyoneyoucanthinkofcide okay.
I do agree with you on one point - the Earth, and our lives, is a 'gift'. But I use the term purely as a metaphor - I don't literally believe life or Earth was 'given' to me. I use the term because I believe ...[text shortened]... al and brief, and I believe I should do what I can to make it a good one for me and others.

But..just because we get a second chance with a resurrection does not mean we don't answer to God...We all reep what we sow. Life then is not promised to anyone.
But what the resurrection will allow is for that person to be judged in a better light. Hitler was one who is condemened by the whole earth. I'm not making light of him by any means. Don't take me wrong. But whatever caused him to be the animal he was, may not have been his fault. Alot of murderers in the world have mental problems that if not there, they probably would have never commited the sick things they've done. I'm not one to judge and Hitler will reap what he did, but that is God's call.

Originally posted by amannion
That's nice of god, allowing us to do whatever we want.
There's an overarching - and overbearing - language of paternalism when it comes to god and its relationship with us humans that I find particularly annoying.

What makes you feel that way? Could you be influanced by anything? Could your viewpoint be wrong?