@chaney3 saidI’ve just given you an example straight from the bible. The three wise men. You’re just ignoring it because it doesn’t fit with your preconceived attitude.
I'm proposing that God does NOT interfere with our choices. He gave us a freedom to choose, and we obviously have consequences with our choices.
You are insisting, for some reason, that God does interfere with our choices. Why?
13 Nov 22
@divegeester saidThat is not an example.
I’ve just given you an example straight from the bible. The three wise men. You’re just ignoring it because it doesn’t fit with your preconceived attitude.
As josephw pointed out, God warned them and they chose to follow. They chose!!
God told Jonah where to go, Jonah chose NOT to go.
@josephw saidTopic changes and sidebars are fine, but you ought to make them a bit more interesting.
Try to be a bit more flexible with regards to the conversation.
Interesting though is your admission that one can make "bad decisions" with "consequences" yet deny accountability to your maker.
Your "shtick" hasn't changed much either.
13 Nov 22
@divegeester saidBe specific.
I’m talking about what you posted which isn’t “salvation”
That way you can hone you derogatory remarks with precision.
13 Nov 22
@bigdogg saidWhat is more "interesting" than receiving forgiveness for a lifetime of poor decision making, the consequences of which results in death?
Topic changes and sidebars are fine, but you ought to make them a bit more interesting.
After all this is a forum discussion related to matters spiritual and the hereafter.
If you don't want to hear about those matters, but deride them and those that express a different view instead, then perhaps you should not post here.
If you think you can achieve immortality in another way, then saying so would be more interesting than hearing the same old naysaying.
14 Nov 22
@fmf saidYour opinion isn't the topic of this thread either.
In the case of this particular thread, "free will", as teed-up up by this OP, is more interesting than your generic proselytising.
And in case you didn't notice I didn't reply to the OP, but instead to statements made by contributors to this thread.
But by all means be as staunch as you will.
- Joined
- 06 May 15
- Moves
- 27444
14 Nov 22
@bigdogg saidSo are you saying Russ has implemented forum code for sidebars? Do tell!
Topic changes and sidebars are fine, but you ought to make them a bit more interesting.
- Joined
- 06 May 15
- Moves
- 27444
14 Nov 22
@chaney3 saidRE: "God, of course, wants us to choose good." How do you know that, and based on what evidence?
I don't know how the Bible addresses the issue of free will, but my understanding is that we are all given the choice to do either good or bad with that choice. God, of course, wants us to choose good.
But.....if we choose to do bad, and our actions will harm an innocent person, how can God stop it? If He stops it, then by default He has impeded upon our choice.
(I coul ...[text shortened]... man's choice to protect another, but let another man commit evil and hurt someone using his choice)
What if God is in the unfortunate (for all sentients in creation) position of being the Prime Ego (and how!) ?
Wouldn't it be more likely that such a cosmic ego-tripping God would hope that we would do evil for the sake of increasing His control over us?
14 Nov 22
@josephw saidCounter proposal: if you can't handle a little derision, then you stop posting here.
What is more "interesting" than receiving forgiveness for a lifetime of poor decision making, the consequences of which results in death?
After all this is a forum discussion related to matters spiritual and the hereafter.
If you don't want to hear about those matters, but deride them and those that express a different view instead, then perhaps you should not post here ...[text shortened]... tality in another way, then saying so would be more interesting than hearing the same old naysaying.
I want to point out the blaring false equivalency that we both use 'shticks'. In this thread, I was following a very specific line of thought in which it was stipulated that god exists. That's way more than you can manage. Temporarily assuming a belief you don't actually hold?! Donald Trump might as well turn Democrat.
@josephw saidI was specific.
Be specific.
That way you can hone you derogatory remarks with precision.
Josephw said:
“forgiveness received is forgiveness bestowed."
divegeester replied:
Oh I see now… Like a Christmas present given is a Christmas present received. Deep wisdom 🙄
No one is mocking “salvation”.
@chaney3 saidSo what you seem to be looking for is an example of where God supernaturally stops someone acting upon a choice they have already made, irrespective of wether they came to that choice on their own or with guidance from God.
That is not an example.
As josephw pointed out, God warned them and they chose to follow. They chose!!
God told Jonah where to go, Jonah chose NOT to go.
Well there are examples of that also …
- Mankind chose to be evil and God intervened and stopped them by wiping them out in a flood.
- Jonah chose to disobey God’s command to preach repentance to Nineveh and God stopped him by shipwrecking him and sending a whale to swallow him.
- the peoples of Sodom and Gomorrah chose to behave in evil ways and God stopped them by wiping those cities from the face of the earth.
- the Egyptian army chose to persue the Israelites to re-enslave them and God stopped them by bringing the waters of the Red Sea down upon them.
There are loads more examples of of where God god both changes a person’s mind and/or completely stops them doing something.
14 Nov 22
@kevin-eleven saidWe know that because it is written so. That is the evidence, and it's all one needs.
RE: "God, of course, wants us to choose good." How do you know that, and based on what evidence?
As responders we choose to believe it or not.