Originally posted by Rajk999I promise I am not trying to be as you say arrogent. But take the verbal abuse I and Robbie and Micahchu put up with here and see how tou'd react.
Mr Galveston, I can bet you any money that the people here on this site will do two things :
1. They will all (including Me and Fabian) sympathize with the 'persecution' you have endured as long as you have stated the truth. Nobody should be persecuted for their beliefs.
2. They have do not have anything against you stating your doctrine. Our problem i ...[text shortened]... eliefs.
In any case what you call persecution is endured by many Christians in other sects.
And if there are other Christain religions that are going thru abuse I'd like to know who they are?
Originally posted by duecerInteresting points for sure. But how could the Jews be who he was speaking of when they never accepted him? He said that his followers would be rejected because of his name and of the work he sent them out to do? The Jews never did anything like that.
Christ was speaking about the future plight of the people of Israel, not Christians living 2000 years later. After Jerusalem's rejection of the messiah, the nation has not seen peace or lasting rest in 2000 years, They (the Jews ) were literally handed over to every ensuing conqueror.
Previous to this statement he gives dire warnings or signs of what will ...[text shortened]... he disciples, and this passage serves as a warning to them...not to believers 2000 years later.
And as has been discussed before the reason of the tumultious times of the early church a few hundred years later was not because of the message they were trying to preach to all the nations but because of the doctrines that were trying to force into their religious system. Doctrines that many knew were wrong and not of Jesus's teachings or from the Bible as a whole.
Let me know what you think...
Originally posted by duecerI've seen the site before and I never said we were the only ones to face problems. But we also face those same problems in those parts of the world. But are these other religions facing it in all the world as we do?
I have over and over again, as has jawill and others. we tire of your rubber/glue arguments, especially when your position has been proven wrong or untenable time and again.
edit: do you really believe that the JW's are the only followers of Christ who are persecuted? follow this very safe link: http://www.persecution.org/suffering/index.php
Here is just a few but I can show more...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jehovah's_Witnesses
http://www.religiousliberty.tv/jehovah%E2%80%99s-witnesses-undergo-persecution-in-the-former-soviet-union.html
http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005433
http://www.amazon.com/Judging-Jehovahs-Witnesses-Persecution-Revolution/dp/0700610081
http://www.kansaspress.ku.edu/petjud.html
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/africa/3663654.stm
http://www.adherents.com/largecom/jw_freedom.html
http://religious-persecution.suite101.com/article.cfm/why_are_jehovahs_witnesses_so_unpopular
From Greece:
http://www.watchtower.org/e/20020122/article_01.htm
http://www.watchtower.org/e/20030401/article_01.htm
From Singapore:
Turning on the floodlight of publicity has often proved to be of great use in our modern-day fight for freedom. After unsuccessful attempts in the Singapore court system to uphold the rights of our brothers, the Governing Body approved the distribution of a special four-page tract to select government officials throughout the world to inform them of the unjust treatment of our brothers in Singapore. The cover of the tract, entitled Religious Persecution in Singapore, displayed a picture of one of the so-called “criminals” who were arrested for possessing Watch Tower literature. Under the picture of our faithful, smiling sister was the caption, “A 71-year-old Witness tells judge: ‘I’m no threat to this government.’ Yet, she was sentenced to prison.”
From: Eritrea
In Eritrea, situated along the Red Sea, our brothers, while not openly brutalized, have lost jobs, housing, and government benefits because of their neutral stand. After The New York Times published an article touting Eritrea’s economic development as an “African Success Story,” the Society’s Legal Department reminded them of the subheading in their article entitled “Jehovah’s Witnesses Suffer Reprisals” and asked if the country could truly be called a “success story.” In response, The New York Times of May 7, 1996, printed the Society’s letter, and the Times itself gave it the bold heading, “Call Eritrea a Failure in Respecting Rights.”
Originally posted by galveston75because of HIM, because of their rejection of him. because of the turmoil that his being brought to their society, because of the paradigm shifts involving social strata
Interesting points for sure. But how could the Jews be who he was speaking of when they never accepted him? He said that his followers would be rejected because of his name and of the work he sent them out to do? The Jews never did anything like that.
And as has been discussed before the reason of the tumultious times of the early church a few hundred ...[text shortened]... rong and not of Jesus's teachings or from the Bible as a whole.
Let me know what you think...
Originally posted by galveston75any kid who goes to school and bows his/her head for grace before lunch faces persecution. any kid who opts out of taking a swig of wine or beer at a party because their faith teaches them its wrong faces persecution.
I've seen the site before and I never said we were the only ones to face problems. But we also face those same problems in those parts of the world. But are these other religions facing it in all the world as we do?
Here is just a few but I can show more...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Jehovah's_Witnesses
http://www.religiousliber ...[text shortened]... and the Times itself gave it the bold heading, “Call Eritrea a Failure in Respecting Rights.”
any adult who insists on not working on Sunday because its the sabbath faces persecution. any parent who withdraws thier kids from school and home schools because the local system is out of control faces persecution.
the difference between them and you is that they don't run around yelling "I'M BEING PERSECUTED FOR MY BELIEFS" and then smugly saying in the same breath that they must be the true Christian.
Originally posted by duecerWell ok then...
any kid who goes to school and bows his/her head for grace before lunch faces persecution. any kid who opts out of taking a swig of wine or beer at a party because their faith teaches them its wrong faces persecution.
any adult who insists on not working on Sunday because its the sabbath faces persecution. any parent who withdraws thier kids from school an ...[text shortened]... MY BELIEFS" and then smugly saying in the same breath that they must be the true Christian.
Originally posted by galveston75They did before yes, and on other occasions we discussed scripture which they quoted.
So when they studied with you they did not show you what they were saying from the bible?
"they" were not saying anything when they were quoting from the bible as the words in the bible were written by other people.
l am interested in discussing many things with many people however when you use scripture as your answer you lose me as l want to know the persons thoughts, not passages from the bible.
Originally posted by nook7So do you not use the Bible or believe in it much?
They did before yes, and on other occasions we discussed scripture which they quoted.
"they" were not saying anything when they were quoting from the bible as the words in the bible were written by other people.
l am interested in discussing many things with many people however when you use scripture as your answer you lose me as l want to know the persons thoughts, not passages from the bible.
Originally posted by galveston75Ok, lets just back up here for a bit...
I think my question was for nook.......
You ,(the JWs), put their doctrine out there. Public forum. House calls. Free propaganda at every turn.
Now you say you cant answer my question because your comment was directed at nook in this public forum?
You are so very frustrating, dear Mustang owner.
Hey nook! Do you think you could ask my question for G75? (😕)
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G-man This has been brought up before. What are your thoughts? Do you agree with 100% of your (JW's) Organization (Your lingo) teachings? What if suddenly they made a proclamation that you deemed non biblical? I just want you to think outside the box for a bit. God (Jehovah)gave you a brain right it's ok to question that is not the sin.
What if they suddenly said it was ok to take blood transfusions for example?
Manny
Originally posted by menace71Manny, you have to somehow realize we aren't stuck in a box. We have our own brains and are able to use them well and with all the thought process your able too.
G-man This has been brought up before. What are your thoughts? Do you agree with 100% of your (JW's) Organization (Your lingo) teachings? What if suddenly they made a proclamation that you deemed non biblical? I just want you to think outside the box for a bit. God (Jehovah)gave you a brain right it's ok to question that is not the sin.
What if they suddenly said it was ok to take blood transfusions for example?
Manny
From the time I started to understand what the Witnesses taught I have questioned as we all do and should. Some at times don't like the answers and that is fine. They are allowed to leave even though it is a sad thing for us as we would miss anyone we've come to know.
But the bible encourages us to question and not just accept age old doctrines.
And I know the situation your speaking of will never happen because I completely agree with the issues such a blood. It's a heard one as I am human just as yourself and it would be a great test on me as I speak from experiance.
But it's something I know Jehovah helped me thru and if it had turned out bad, then he promises a resurrection just like he has to all who remain faithful under trial. Think of Abraham. Could you have done that?