Originally posted by jaywill1. I'm sorry to hear about this. I'm sure we've all been through similar tough times.
I witnessed my dear younger brother weaken and weaken and finally die of HIV infection. He was in the gay community on the west coast in San Francisco.
2. How is this in any way an answer to my objection to you calling people "irrational and paranoid" if they don't share your superstition about homosexuals.
3. Did you think the little tragic autobiographical detail would stifle further objection?
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Originally posted by stellspalfie
you seem to be proud that you are 'tolerant' but when it comes to homosexuality there should be nothing that needs tolerating. they is nothing to tolerate. you tell me what aspects of homosexuality you bugs you? your tolerance is also limited, you have the knowledge that if they dont change their ways they will go to hell. thats not tolerance, thats jus ns should live"
talk me through what happens if a homosexual turns to god for help?[/b]
you seem to be proud that you are 'tolerant' but when it comes to homosexuality there should be nothing that needs tolerating.
I am not proud. I am thankful that the humanity of Christ is so pure and so fine. I am in the process of learning to have His tastes, attitudes, actions, reactions to people of all types.
You really should study how Jesus Himself dealt with all kinds of sinners in the Gospels. What a MAN He is. And His life is available to us because "the last Adam became a life giving Spirit" .
Do you know how tolerant and forebearing the Lord Jesus was with ME ?? It is a joy that I can live through Him and express some of that same forebearance and love towards sinners.
they is nothing to tolerate. you tell me what aspects of homosexuality you bugs you? your tolerance is also limited, you have the knowledge that if they dont change their ways they will go to hell.
If a person believes into Jesus Christ he will not perish forever.
Paul's word that such will not inherit the kingdom of God is not a word about going to hell. It is a word about the believer not being sufficiently sanctified to be a practical participant in the coming kingdom of God in the 1,000 year millennial kingdom.
You may fail to differentiate between eternal salvation and sanctification for the reward of the millennial kingdom of 1,000 years before the eternal age begins.
This depends on how you understand these words that Paul spoke to Christians, for whom the question of eternal redemption was already settled in the affirmative:
"For this you realize, knowing that every fornicator or unclean person or greedy person (who is an idolater) has no inheritance in the kingdom of Christ and of God. " (Ephesians 5:5)
" ... of which I tell you beforehand, even as I have said before, that those who practice such things will not inherit the kingdom of God." (Gal. 5:21)
"Or do you not know that the unrighteous will not inherit the kingdom of God ? " (1 Cor. 5:9)
I do not take these three warnings to Christians, that the practicers of the errors cannot be saved forever and never perish in the lake of fire. I take these three warnings to Christian churches to mean subjective transformation and subjective sanctification is needed to prepare one to participate in the kingdom of God to come.
You see, every believer eventually will be subdued by Christ's love to be absolute for Him. We can postpone this. We cannot avoid this. It is the rejection of Christ which leads to eternal punishment.
So nothing I have written explained that a homosexual will perish forever if she or he believes into Christ for salvation. That meets his or her need. What about God's need though ? God needs to conform us to the image of Christ in sanctification for participants in His kingdom.
The question of sanctification and transformation is really a question about the need of God to conform us to the image of Christ.
thats not tolerance, thats just playing the long game. if you can look somebody in the face and be friendly to them, but equally be okay with the fact that they are going to be punished for eternity then thats border line psychopathic, i personally would be distraught if i went through life looking at the majority of the world and thinking they are all going to suffer.
No one knows the final number of people being saved forever and those perishing forever. I obey the Lord Jesus to do my part to share the good news of His redemption. And I do my part to let His light shine through my living.
If you really cared you would believe into Jesus Christ yourself. The greatest gift of love you could give to your gay friends is for you yourself to show them you have trusted in Jesus.
It is rather tragic that one goes through life with so many excuses not to trust in the saving work of Christ. And you will never attain to some moral high ground above those who have realized that they are only sinners and come to Christ for salvation.
It is the right thing to do for a man to come to the Savior Jesus the Son of God. And you will never ever boast of the moral high ground over the least of us who have trusted our lives over to the Son of God.
at the end of the day you, your love of your god blinds your logic. you can avoid dealing with the issues by saying you are nice to homosexuals, while in the next breath you are looking forward to the return of christ which will also bring about the destruction of billions of really nice people, some who happen to be gay.
You don't care for them. You only love yourself so as to keep yourself away from the Son of God. If you loved your gay friends you would show them that you too have trusted in Christ for salvation.
At least I open the door of the gospel to all unbelievers. You have shut the door for yourself. Like the Pharisees, you will not enter yourself and are angry that sinners, including the gay, would enter in to be saved.
"Since more and more people are being enfluenced by homosexuality"
what does this mean???? how are people being more influenced by homosexuality? what does being influenced by homosexuality even mean? what is the outcome of this influence that is a problem?
isnt god the biggest discriminator in existence?
Iniquity is on the rise. Some proud graduate student or Phd. goes about to make a name for himself by encouraging people that the sin in their flesh is something they should just accept.
Tomorrow it may be that to marry one's own son or daughter is something we ar born with. Perhaps the marriage of animals will be a right that other deceived people will clamor for. Perhaps people will fight for the right to molest children.
This is not being "progressive". This is society rotting. You accuse me of pride. But I think you are proud that you are being swept away downstream like a dead leaf, in societies ever worsening corruption.
The Gospel of Jesus is the way I want to go.
"So why not we go to God to receive light on how we humans should live"
talk me through what happens if a homosexual turns to god for help?
Go read some testimonies from those who have found release in and freedom in Jesus Christ. I'm sure if you put in some effort you can find some who will vouch for the saving grace they found in Jesus.
I have known a number of such people who found that the Son sets us free to be free indeed. Our weaknesses encourage us to stay close to the Lord. Because we know that we cannot overcome many things, these things give us the incentive to cling close to the available Lord Jesus.
"And you shall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free." (John 8:32)
Originally posted by stellspalfieDid you have to say "talk me through" to jaywill? Sheesh, now I gotta read another huge post to make sure I'm up to date with this thread.
you seem to be proud that you are 'tolerant' but when it comes to homosexuality there should be nothing that needs tolerating. they is nothing to tolerate. you tell me what aspects of homosexuality you bugs you? your tolerance is also limited, you have the knowledge that if they dont change their ways they will go to hell. thats not tolerance, thats jus ...[text shortened]... ns should live"
talk me through what happens if a homosexual turns to god for help?[/b]
Next time could you ask for the bullet point , stripped back version?
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Originally posted by jaywillWhat nonsense. Forever you keep us returning to Christ and our need to "conform to Christs image", whatever that means. (Obviously this is not going to mean the same thing to everyone, but fortunatly we have you to do our thinking for us. )you seem to be proud that you are 'tolerant' but when it comes to homosexuality there should be nothing that needs tolerating.
I am not proud. I am thankful that the humanity of Christ is so pure and so fine. I am in the process of learning to have His tastes, attitudes, actions, reactions to people of all types.
You really should st hall know the truth, and the truth shall set you free." (John 8:32) [/b]
Why do you equate fully mature human beings (gays) , and their right to love each other , as a sign that the world is on moral decline?
"Perhaps marriage of animals will be a right that other..[text shortened]..right to molest children".
what utterly insane logic you have here. Again, how can you equate what consenting adults do with what animals and peadophiles do? You dont expect anyone (except maybe Robbie Carrobie ) to buy this do you?
How about just answering questions a bit more directly ?
(I know I 've asked you this before and I remember your answer, but do you think you could humor me again? )
Some people just have this "be-all(knowing)" posting style which makes me think that something is not quite right. We are human after all are we not? And if one were born in India B.C. and became a Buddhist and had their spiritual life taken care of, what use would this future JC have to one ?
Originally posted by Rajk999seems your "worth their salt christians" aren't very christian
That is a 'sort of nonsense' statement.
Christians worth their salt can say nothing different than ..
".... The Bible says that homosexuality is a sin and those who sin according to Christ will not inherit the Kingdom of God .."
Christians should however resist the temptation to tell anyone they are going to hell because nobody but Christ can condemn people.
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Originally posted by jaywillHow can animals or children give their informed consent to marriage or sex? Is it homosexuals coercing each other into sex that you object to? Seeking to conflate homosexuality with bestiality and paedophilia is the kind of clumsy doesn't-withstand-scrutiny gambit which we get on the Debates Forum from boggle-eyed far right misanthropes.
Perhaps the marriage of animals will be a right that other deceived people will clamor for. Perhaps people will fight for the right to molest children.
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Originally posted by FMFthank you for making that point more succinctly than I.
How can animals or children give their informed consent to marriage or sex? Is it homosexuals [b]coercing each other into sex that you object to? Seeking to conflate homosexuality with bestiality and paedophilia is the kind of clumsy doesn't-withstand-scrutiny gambit which we get on the Debates Forum from boggle-eyed far right misanthropes.[/b]
Originally posted by FMFIt is because there is a lot of adult to child stuff that goes on it the gay peoples life style.
How can animals or children give their informed consent to marriage or sex? Is it homosexuals [b]coercing each other into sex that you object to? Seeking to conflate homosexuality with bestiality and paedophilia is the kind of clumsy doesn't-withstand-scrutiny gambit which we get on the Debates Forum from boggle-eyed far right misanthropes.[/b]
Lots of the gay men rape little boys.
Originally posted by RBHILLBit early in the morning is it?
It is because there is a lot of adult to child stuff that goes on it the gay peoples life style.
Lots of the gay men rape little boys.
Are you kidding with that comment? Do you have any stats to back that up?
I'd be seriously offended by that post if I were gay . Perhaps that is your intent - to make life hell for gays, lest they repent (?)