That's a wrong answer. If god created the world and he's almighty (and why wouldn't he be, cause a 2000 year old book says so...) then he also created evil. He created the possibility that someone would do evil. He could also have made the world violence-free. It is totally injust imo that god allows followers of him to get the most horrible accidents and diseases. If I'd meet god, I hope he comes up with a better answer, cause 'free will' is just looking the other way.
Originally posted by RAU4ever That's a wrong answer. If god created the world and he's almighty (and why wouldn't he be, cause a 2000 year old book says so...) then he also created evil. He created the possibility that someone would do evil. He could also have made the world violence-free. It is totally injust imo that god allows followers of him to get the most horrible accidents and d ...[text shortened]... I hope he comes up with a better answer, cause 'free will' is just looking the other way.
He gave us a choice...he never said it was going to be easy...
Originally posted by Starrman ...is something you neither understand nor value, you must hate humanity.
Oh i understand it perfectly and i value the choices i make in life and that makes me love life and humanity.... i can hate someone for their actions but their actions was from their choice so my choice was to decide to hate them...i dont have to hate them but i do...i could choose to forgive and like them...much better actions...its that choice that makes me love humanity!
Free will doesn't answer the questions. With free will you can't explain that there are diseases in the world. You can't explain that some people get born with a handicap. Why is god so unjust to allow this? He could have prevented this, as he's almighty.
I have to offer my apologies to the thread-starter, I feel like I have hijacked your thread and I will not continue with this discussion. (I'll look for a more apropriate place I think).
Originally posted by KellyJay What content do you want to discuss?
Kelly
Context - not content. I'd like to discuss why Christians think my literal readings of the Bible are flawed because of the "context". They never seem to want to elaborate but like to stop there.
Knightmeister is the person who comes to mind for challenging me like this. I'll see if I can find the specific posts.
Originally posted by AThousandYoung Context - not content. I'd like to discuss why Christians think my literal readings of the Bible are flawed because of the "context". They never seem to want to elaborate but like to stop there.
Knightmeister is the person who comes to mind for challenging me like this. I'll see if I can find the specific posts.
On the subject of "Meeting God" I think we should consider the few models we have of people doing so. My interest is first in the most positive examples.
Enoch in the book Genesis is an example given of a person who went to meet God. This is very positive and therefore "normal" example of what meeting God should be.
"And Jared lived a hundred sixty two years and begot Enoch. And Jared lived after he had begotten Enoch eight hundred years, and he begot more sons and daughters. And all the days of Jared were nine hundred sixty-two years, and he died.
And Enoch lived sixty-five years and begot Methuselah. And Enoch walked with God after he had begotten Methuselad three hundred years, and he begot more sons and daughters. And all the days of Enoch were three hundred sixty-five years. And Enoch walked with God, and he was not for God took him" (Genesis 5:18-24)
After the fall of Adam the Bible lists a long list of men and ends each summary with "and he died". One after another of, for each of these most ancient patriarch the Bible records "... and he died"
Then a man, Enoch, had a son and afterwards "walked with God". He lived daily in the spiritual presence of God. He lived step by step in the presence of God until he walked with God.
Probably Enoch walked with God because God had revealed to him that judgment day was coming. The name of Enoch's son was Methuselah. And that name means something like "when he dies it will come."
The event that was coming, when Methuselah was to die, was the flood of Noah which wiped out the wicked off the face of the earth. Enoch named his son "when he dies it will come" and then walked with God for three hundred years.
The Bible does not say od Enoch "and he died" but "and he was not, for God took him". He just disappeared one day. He was raptured by God and taken away.
The point is that Enoch walked with God until he was closer to God's home than he was to his own. God took him right into His presence. Enoch probably was not shocked. He simply transitioned smoothly from one realm to another. He literally walked right into the very place where God was.
This early account is given to us of the most normal (not average) but normal way for man to "meet God". He should daily, year after year, walk with God. Then whether by death or by rapture or by meeting Christ in His second coming, the man or woman simply makes a smooth transition into another realm. Their heart and their inner being were already there with God. It only needs for their physical being to join where they have been walking daily for a long time.
So were you trying to answer the question you replied to or were you simply trying to pretend you knew the answer? If you really know the answer then please explain with more than a couple of words. Just saying "Free Will", doesn't really answer anything.
Originally posted by twhitehead So were you trying to answer the question you replied to or were you simply trying to pretend you knew the answer? If you really know the answer then please explain with more than a couple of words. Just saying "Free Will", doesn't really answer anything.
You do know what free will is dont you? do i really have to explain!!!!????
Originally posted by huckleberryhound ...What would you say/ask/tell the big chap ?
Let's say he exist (sorry athiests), and you actually met him/her/it....What would your first sensible/legible words be ?
I would say... Dear God ...thank you for helping me understand that people we love very much are taken away from their children/spouses/siblings/parents/lovers for a reason, that all the hoping/wishing for a miracle to happen, promising to sing your praises forever will stop the pain of someone close to you slipping away ... NOT!
Originally posted by Jay Joos You do know what free will is dont you? do i really have to explain!!!!????
I know what I believe free will to be. However as demonstrated in about 20 different threads on this forum, what I believe free will is differs significantly from what other people may think it is. What I think it is, does not in any way answer the question you were responding to. So, yes, you do need to explain (or admit that you were just trying to avoid a difficult question).
Originally posted by twhitehead I know what I believe free will to be. However as demonstrated in about 20 different threads on this forum, what I believe free will is differs significantly from what other people may think it is. What I think it is, does not in any way answer the question you were responding to. So, yes, you do need to explain (or admit that you were just trying to avoid a difficult question).
To me free will is about God gracing us with choices...a choice to be good or a choice to be bad...its our decision.
26 Sep '07 10:01
If you met God....
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