Is Jesus enough?

Originally posted by checkbaiter
When Jesus judges, separates the goats from the sheep, what makes one righteous? I know your answer, follow the teachings of Jesus and the Apostles, but we will still sin on a day to day basis.
God is holy and hates sin. So since we will all have sin, how easy it will be for us to be judged.
Every one of us will be cast in the Lake of fire don't you think?

Being judged is not the same as being condemned.

I judge someone who steals, guilty of theft. Do I condemn them for the rest of their life or do I forgive them?

Also, I don't know of any reference to a lake of fire that sinners will be cast into. The only one of those I have read about in the bible are for Satan and his followers.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
You have made this point abundantly clear. But that does not answer my question.
Ok, so Jesus paid for our sins once. Got that....now if I have a bad thought, etc., and sin...how is that sin paid for?, since there remains no more sacrifice? Am I now condemned?

No not once at all but as long as we are in an imperfect state as we all are in.
His sacrifice makes it possible that we may now have forgiveness "daily" as we all sin daily.
Do you remember the Lord's prayer that at the end of it Jesus told us to ask for forgiveness, "daily".
None of us as imperfect humans have our sins just forgiven without asking for them to be forgiven and even that is not a given IF we keep doing a specific sin on purpose. This is where the practicing of a sin on purpose will not be forgiven unless we make ever effort to stop doing it. An example would be of stealing or murder, or practicing a sexual activity that is forbidden. This is why "if one continues to practice sin knowing it is wrong, there is no longer any forgiveness for that person".
This sacrifice Jesus made also did away with us having to do a literal sacrifice at an alter as God's people did before Jesus.

Originally posted by MISTER CHESS
Being judged is not the same as being condemned.

I judge someone who steals, guilty of theft. Do I condemn them for the rest of their life or do I forgive them?

Also, I don't know of any reference to a lake of fire that sinners will be cast into. The only one of those I have read about in the bible are for Satan and his followers.

Good comments...

Originally posted by Rajk999
Apparently it is hard for you to accept what the Bible says. These roundabout questions serve no purpose. Here are the facts:

1. Christ died for us
2. We accept Christ and vow to follow his path
3. We still sin on occasion
4. We still follow in his footsteps to the best of our ability [hopefully]
5. Christ judges [it is not for you to say it is easy or hard as that is not your place]

I don't have any problem accepting what the bible says. But I think you have a poor understanding of what the bible says. I am simply having a civil discourse. I am trying to understand your position here, vs what I believe.

Humor me for just awhile longer, please...

Why did Christ have to die for us? I ask this because I believe he died to save us from our sins past, present and future, while you believe only for past sins.

But if one comes to Jesus when he/she is young and tries to obey him but fails from time to time, some more that others, don't you see you will have many years of sins, thousands and thousands depending on how long one lives. What happens to these sins? Are they just forgiven?

Yes, we read the bible and obey what it says, but it does not mean you don't think these things through. After all, God did give us a brain. Are we not to ask questions? Do you just blindly follow your leaders?
I hope not. I ask God about things in his word.

Originally posted by galveston75
No not once at all but as long as we are in an imperfect state as we all are in.
His sacrifice makes it possible that we may now have forgiveness "daily" as we all sin daily.
Do you remember the Lord's prayer that at the end of it Jesus told us to ask for forgiveness, "daily".
None of us as imperfect humans have our sins just forgiven without askin ...[text shortened]... did away with us having to do a literal sacrifice at an alter as God's people did before Jesus.

Alright, but I see on this forum that you continually ridicule people like RJ.
So are you condemned?
And if sin can just be forgiven, why was there a blood sacrifice for Adam and Eve?

Originally posted by checkbaiter
I don't have any problem accepting what the bible says. But I think you have a poor understanding of what the bible says. I am simply having a civil discourse. I am trying to understand your position here, vs what I believe.

Humor me for just awhile longer, please...

Why did Christ have to die for us? I ask this because I believe he died to save us ...[text shortened]... tions? Do you just blindly follow your leaders?
I hope not. I ask God about things in his word.

I believe in past sins only? Me or did I quote you two passages from the Apostles that said that .. the Bible said that.

Christ will forgive and judge and reward and punish as he sees fit.
You are trying to ask questions with the intention of trapping me.
I am sticking with the clear teachings of the Bible.

If you believe otherwise then spill it out with some Bible verses.
Notice I quote the Bible and leave you to read it for yourself.

Please do not preach .. Bible verses .. thanks.

Originally posted by MISTER CHESS
Being judged is not the same as being condemned.

I judge someone who steals, guilty of theft. Do I condemn them for the rest of their life or do I forgive them?

Also, I don't know of any reference to a lake of fire that sinners will be cast into. The only one of those I have read about in the bible are for Satan and his followers.

Matt 5:22-23
But whoever says, 'You fool!' shall be in danger of hell fire.
NKJV

Matt 18:9
And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.
NKJV

Matt 23:33
Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell?
NKJV

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Alright, but I see on this forum that you continually ridicule people like RJ.
So are you condemned?
And if sin can just be forgiven, why was there a blood sacrifice for Adam and Eve?

R u serious? Isn't this whole debate about why and when sin can be forgiven?

What the feck has the point been if not that?

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Matt 5:22-23
But whoever says, 'You fool!' shall be in danger of hell fire.
NKJV

Matt 18:9
And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.
NKJV

Matt 23:33
Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell?
NKJV

Hell is not an accurate translation of the text. All one needs to do is look at the original Hebrew and Greek words, in fact, there is no concept of a Hell in the entire portion of the Hebrew scriptures, nor the Greek, its essentially a pagan concept, supported by an inaccurate translation of the original. The word that you are looking for is Gehenna, taken from the valley of Hinnom, a symbol of eternal destruction, not torment as your translation erroneously tries to mask.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Matt 5:22-23
But whoever says, 'You fool!' shall be in danger of hell fire.
NKJV

Matt 18:9
And if your eye causes you to sin, pluck it out and cast it from you. It is better for you to enter into life with one eye, rather than having two eyes, to be cast into hell fire.
NKJV

Matt 23:33
Serpents, brood of vipers! How can you escape the condemnation of hell?
NKJV

None of that is a reference to a lake of fire.

The original text speaks of Gehenna, not hell. Gehenna was a place where children were sacrificed to a pagan god and then became a burning trash heap.

So these quotes don't even refer to a place you go after you die but rather are comparing the fate of Gehenna with the fate of a sinner.

Originally posted by MISTER CHESS
None of that is a reference to a lake of fire.

The original text speaks of Gehenna, not hell. Gehenna was a place where children were sacrificed to a pagan god and then became a burning trash heap.

So these quotes don't even refer to a place you go after you die but rather are comparing the fate of Gehenna with the fate of a sinner.

How about this one?

Rev 20:15
And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
NKJV

Great thread title , man. That's my vote for thread title of the year for sure!


Also that line ... "it's time to learn the truth." - another classic.
Now , I'm wagering that if you really knew only half of the truth of what was going on on this planet since the time of Jesus you'd be unable to digest it.


Ok... sorry for interupting your thread, carry and I wish nothing but enlightenment for you and yours 🙂

Originally posted by checkbaiter
How about this one?

Rev 20:15
And anyone not found written in the Book of Life was cast into the lake of fire.
NKJV

That is the second death.

That is the lake of fire that is made for Satan's followers.

This passage in context would show you that everybody had lived for a thousand years and then satan was released again. Then those who succumbed to his temptations after his release and followed him were thrown into the lake of fire.

Originally posted by checkbaiter
Alright, but I see on this forum that you continually ridicule people like RJ.
So are you condemned?
And if sin can just be forgiven, why was there a blood sacrifice for Adam and Eve?

In reality we are all condemned as the Bible says we are all sinners and all die because of it. In fact if it wasn't for the love that Jehovah God and his son Jesus has for all humans we would have no future at all.
This is why from the instant Adam sinned he put into works the eventuality of his son coming to earth to die for us to all have the chance to gain back what Adam lost for us and that was to live forever on a paradise earth. A perfect human life (Jesus) for a perfect human life ( Adam).
Now we all have the chance to gain that back if we do as God ask of us.

The reason I seem to ridicule some here which is really not always the best thing to do, I admit, but it just hurts to see some such as RJH not even recognize who Jehovah God is and even deny his existance and sometimes paint what a Christian is in a very bad light.
I do get defensive about his claims and misrepresentations and his condemnation of anyone who doesn't agree with him.

Originally posted by Rajk999
I believe in past sins only? Me or did I quote you two passages from the Apostles that said that .. the Bible said that.

Christ will forgive and judge and reward and punish as he sees fit.
You are trying to ask questions with the intention of trapping me.
I am sticking with the clear teachings of the Bible.

If you believe otherwise then spill it ou ...[text shortened]... Bible and leave you to read it for yourself.

Please do not preach .. Bible verses .. thanks.

So you don't think? You only quote the bible? You clearly do not understand what it says.
Scripture is to be digested so that you have it in your heart and can say the same thing with different words, no?
If you believe the scriptures you quote in Hebrews, then how do you explain these verses?

Rom 4:8
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin."
NKJV
Rom 4:8
8 Blessed is the man to whom the Lord shall not impute sin."
NKJV

Rom 5:8-9
But God demonstrates His own love toward us, in that while we were still sinners, Christ died for us. 9 Much more then, having now been justified by His blood, we shall be saved from wrath through Him.
NKJV

Notice the past tense in the above verse?

Rom 5:20-21
But where sin abounded, grace abounded much more, 21 so that as sin reigned in death, even so grace might reign through righteousness to eternal life through Jesus Christ our Lord.
NKJV

Eph 1:13-14
In Him you also trusted, after you heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation; in whom also, having believed, you were sealed with the Holy Spirit of promise, 14 who is the guarantee of our inheritance until the redemption of the purchased possession, to the praise of His glory.
NKJV

You do know what guarantee means right?

Eph 2:8-10
8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
NKJV

I have to leave for now, back later..