Originally posted by @kellyjayYou're stonewalling again.
If you are not walking in the Spirit, not doing the things God has for you, what is it you are
doing but living in the flesh which cannot please God. It is a relationship, God in us and
us in God, as we walk out our lives with Him. If you reject God which is within your power
to do, you will hear the words, "I never knew you." All of the things you trus ...[text shortened]... gs of this world over God. In Christ we are forgiven, outside of
Christ we are condemn already.
Originally posted by @fmfNice summary lol
My suggestion:
[b]I am the way = obeying me is the way
Your suggestion:
I am the way = Our sins cut us off from God, when Jesus died the curtain of the temple was torn from top to bottom. Our sins no longer cut us off from God. We were dead in our sins before God without hope, Jesus changed that being the Life, in Christ we are given the L ...[text shortened]... aking the words and subject matter for that text to mean only what it says nothing more", is it?[/b]
Originally posted by @kellyjayWhat exactly is walking in the Spirit
If you are not walking in the Spirit, not doing the things God has for you, what is it you are
doing but living in the flesh which cannot please God. It is a relationship, God in us and
us in God, as we walk out our lives with Him. If you reject God which is within your power
to do, you will hear the words, "I never knew you." All of the things you trus ...[text shortened]... gs of this world over God. In Christ we are forgiven, outside of
Christ we are condemn already.
Originally posted by @rajk999Being born again receiving God's Spirit changes us.
What exactly is walking in the Spirit
If we are walking after the flesh than we are walking as everyone else who does not know the Lord.
Walking by the Spirit we will not live to gratify the desire of our flesh, our focus is on God.
Romans 8:3-5 English Standard Version (ESV)
3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, could not do. By sending his own Son in the likeness of sinful flesh and for sin, he condemned sin in the flesh, 4 in order that the righteous requirement of the law might be fulfilled in us, who walk not according to the flesh but according to the Spirit. 5 For those who live according to the flesh set their minds on the things of the flesh, but those who live according to the Spirit set their minds on the things of the Spirit.
Galatians 5:15-17 English Standard Version (ESV)
15 But if you bite and devour one another, watch out that you are not consumed by one another.
16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the flesh. 17 For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do.
Ephesians 2:1-3 English Standard Version (ESV)
By Grace Through Faith
2 And you were dead in the trespasses and sins 2 in which you once walked, following the course of this world, following the prince of the power of the air, the spirit that is now at work in the sons of disobedience— 3 among whom we all once lived in the passions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.
Originally posted by @kellyjayI wasn't trying to add anything just understand how you see the verse in context with the rest of the chapter.
John 14 English Standard Version (ESV)
14 “Let not your hearts be troubled. Believe in God; believe also in me. 2 In my Father's house are many rooms. If it were not so, would I have told you that I go to prepare a place for you? 3 And if I go and prepare a place for you, I will come again and will take you to myself, that where I am you may be also. 4 An ...[text shortened]... tresses the point that if we attempt to go to the Father with out Jesus, we will not get
there.
Even in the verses you've highlighted (before we get to 15, 21 and 23) Jesus is saying the Father is seen in the works he'd been doing and that whoever believes in him will also do the works.
In other words we are what we do.
Originally posted by @fmfSince KellyJay has so clearly failed to answer the OP, perhaps I as an atheist can shed some light on what I understand by this Christian mantra, which, by the way, is merely a 18th century translation of an ancient Hebrew text and, therefore, not to be taken too literally. “The way” = the portal, the means by which you will achieve everlasting life.
John 14:6: “I am the way, and the truth, and the life; no one comes to the Father but through Me."
What precise meanings or definitions do you attach to the words "way" and "comes to" and "through" in this verse?
“Comes to” = is conferred everlasting life from.
“Through me” = by following my example and philosophy.
Originally posted by @ragwortIn the context of the rest of the chapter, you mean when He changes topics?
I wasn't trying to add anything just understand how you see the verse in context with the rest of the chapter.
Even in the verses you've highlighted (before we get to 15, 21 and 23) Jesus is saying the Father is seen in the works he'd been doing and that whoever believes in him will also do the works.
In other words we are what we do.
1 edit
Originally posted by @fmfRather, John 14:6 is what it is, FMF. It means what it means. The words are what the words are. It says what it says. No amount of opaque and fanciful verbiage will turn it into the atheistic works-over-faith cop out you want it to be. 😉
John 14:6 is what it is, KellyJay. It means what it means. The words are what the words are. It says what it says. No amount of opaque and fanciful verbiage will turn it into the OSAS cop out you want it to be. 😉
And neither will you getting your buds in here to back you up.
Vox Populi, is it? Vox ignorantia, more like it.
Originally posted by @pianoman1The words either are taken as is or they are meaningless. Changing the text to talk about
Since KellyJay has so clearly failed to answer the OP, perhaps I as an atheist can shed some light on what I understand by this Christian mantra, which, by the way, is merely a 18th century translation of an ancient Hebrew text and, therefore, not to be taken too literally. “The way” = the portal, the means by which you will achieve everlasting life.
“C ...[text shortened]... ” = is conferred everlasting life from.
“Through me” = by following my example and philosophy.
what isn't written is not speaking to the text as is. Jumping through hoops on what it could
mean if we look at the words if they mean, this, or that has left the text and now all you are
doing is playing with yourself.
Originally posted by @kellyjayWrong. Jesus said in many places to follow the commandments to get eternal life .. not just follow the commandments.
There are plenty of places where Jesus says follow commandments, but this isn't one of
them. Here Jesus is talking about Himself, just because something is said in one place
means it is said every place, read the text without adding or taking away from what it says.
Scripture interprets scripture. Therefore you are wrong to place your own interpretation on Jesus being the way.
Originally posted by @kellyjaySo following the commandments of Christ is exactly the same as walking in the Spirit.
Being born again receiving God's Spirit changes us.
If we are walking after the flesh than we are walking as everyone else who does not know the Lord.
Walking by the Spirit we will not live to gratify the desire of our flesh, our focus is on God.
Romans 8:3-5 English Standard Version (ESV)
3 For God has done what the law, weakened by the flesh, coul ...[text shortened]... esires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind.
Originally posted by @rajk999Following the Spirit is just that, following Him, you are right in that when we do that we
So following the commandments of Christ is exactly the same as walking in the Spirit.
will do the commandments of God, but the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of God.
Jesus said when He was about to leave us that He was going to send us a Helper, the
Holy Spirit is His own being He is not an action we do.
John 14:26
But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in my name, he will teach you all things and bring to your remembrance all that I have said to you.
Luke 3:16
John answered them all, saying, “I baptize you with water, but he who is mightier than I is coming, the strap of whose sandals I am not worthy to untie. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire.
Luke 11:13
If you then, who are evil, know how to give good gifts to your children, how much more will the heavenly Father give the Holy Spirit to those who ask him!”