1. Standard membervivify
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    03 Sep '15 13:49
    http://www.bbc.com/news/technology-31042477

    In this story from the BBC, a Swedish corporation called Epicenter implants a chip into it's employees. This chip allows the same type of access that a pass card gives into some government offices.

    What's interesting, is that there's a video of a BBC reported getting this chip implanted into his left hand (or forehead), which is how the Bible describes the Mark of the Beast will be placed. Here's one more video regarding the chip:

    YouTube

    So...

    My fellow atheists: why isn't this a legitimate concern? Are Christians on to something here with the Mark of the Beast idea? If not, why?
  2. Cape Town
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    03 Sep '15 15:47
    Originally posted by vivify
    My fellow atheists: why isn't this a legitimate concern? Are Christians on to something here with the Mark of the Beast idea? If not, why?
    Tagging people with RFID chips is a legitimate concern for everyone. The 'Mark of the Beast' most definitely is not.

    However, the privacy issues surrounding tagging people with RFID chips are largely made redundant by the cell phone ie if you want to track someone it is far far easier to track their cell phone than to track them by RFID which has a very short range.
    I have often suggested to theists that the 'Mark the the Beast' may be the smart phone but I never get a response. I think that people are very happy to be afraid of the Mark of the Beast so long as it doesn't cost them anything. The moment RFID becomes useful most theists will shut up about it and name something else the 'Mark of the Beast'.

    Lets not get started on Google Glass.
  3. Standard membervivify
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    03 Sep '15 16:011 edit
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Tagging people with RFID chips is a legitimate concern for everyone. The 'Mark of the Beast' most definitely is not.

    However, the privacy issues surrounding tagging people with RFID chips are largely made redundant by the cell phone ie if you want to track someone it is far far easier to track their cell phone than to track them by RFID which has a ver ...[text shortened]... out it and name something else the 'Mark of the Beast'.

    Lets not get started on Google Glass.
    The big difference here is that this is actually goes on a person's hand, as described in the Bible. A cell phone isn't implanted in you. I think that's why you haven't gotten a response.

    Furthermore, a scenario where the chip is "useful" is exactly what Christians have been saying regarding the Mark of the Beast: no one will be able to "buy or sell" without it. If this chip is one day able to replace debit or credit cards, the "Mark" is no longer in the realm of fantasy. Right?
  4. Standard memberRajk999
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    03 Sep '15 16:11
    Originally posted by vivify
    The big difference here is that this is actually goes on a person's hand, as described in the Bible. A cell phone isn't implanted in you. I think that's why you haven't gotten a response.

    Furthermore, a scenario where the chip is "useful" is exactly what Christians have been saying regarding the Mark of the Beast: no one will be able to "buy or sell" wit ...[text shortened]... able to replace debit or credit cards, the "Mark" is no longer in the realm of fantasy. Right?
    There is a critical piece of detail which you seem to be overlooking. This beast or the image of this beast must be worshiped otherwise you will be killed.

    Worship or be killed.... Has not happened and I cannot see that happening in any developed western nation.

    Of course there are people just dying to see this happen becuase it signals the end of the end times, that they latch on to foolishness like credit card implants and tracking devices etc etc.

    There is a long way to go yet.
  5. Cape Town
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    03 Sep '15 16:25
    Originally posted by vivify
    The big difference here is that this is actually goes on a person's hand, as described in the Bible. A cell phone isn't implanted in you. I think that's why you haven't gotten a response.
    No, I think the Bible is subject to some amount of interpretation, and I haven't gotten a response because nobody wants to give up their smartphone.

    Furthermore, a scenario where the chip is "useful" is exactly what Christians have been saying regarding the Mark of the Beast: no one will be able to "buy or sell" without it. If this chip is one day able to replace debit or credit cards, the "Mark" is no longer in the realm of fantasy. Right?
    The cell phone already does everything the 'Mark of the Beast' requires including replacing credit cards. It is not required to buy and sell, but then neither is the credit card.
    And yes, the 'Mark' as in the Biblical version is most definitely forever in the realm of fantasy.
  6. Standard membervivify
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    03 Sep '15 16:27
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    There is a critical piece of detail which you seem to be overlooking. This beast or the image of this beast must be worshiped otherwise you will be killed.

    Worship or be killed.... Has not happened and I cannot see that happening in any developed western nation.

    Of course there are people just dying to see this happen becuase it signals the end of ...[text shortened]... shness like credit card implants and tracking devices etc etc.

    There is a long way to go yet.
    The Beast and the Mark of the Beast aren't the same thing. There's no requirement to worship the Mark of the Beast.
  7. Cape Town
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    03 Sep '15 16:31
    Originally posted by vivify
    A cell phone isn't implanted in you.
    I have to point out that the Bible verses in question say nothing about implanting.
  8. Standard membervivify
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    03 Sep '15 16:40
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    I have to point out that the Bible verses in question say nothing about implanting.
    True. It only says "receive". However, the only way to receive a "mark" would be for that mark to be attached to your body somehow (like a tattoo).
  9. Cape Town
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    03 Sep '15 16:44
    Originally posted by vivify
    True. It only says "receive". However, the only way to receive a "mark" would be for that mark to be attached to your body somehow (like a tattoo).
    Why do you insist on that? I suspect you are saying that specifically to exclude cell phones and no other reason.
    It is perfectly reasonable to consider a cellphone to be a 'mark'. It is a uniquely identifying item that you keep on you at all times and is either in your right hand or by your ear (or in the case of Google Glass, on your forehead).
  10. Standard memberRajk999
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    03 Sep '15 16:46
    Originally posted by vivify
    The Beast and the Mark of the Beast aren't the same thing. There's no requirement to worship the Mark of the Beast.
    I think you are missing the point. The Mark of the Beast is an indication that the person is agreeeing to worship the Beast, or the Image of the Beast.

    The important thing in this is that those that are Christs will not worship the Beast which is demonstrated by receiving his Mark.

    Worship of the Beast = receiving of the Mark.

    Not receiving the Mark = Death.

    You seem to be trying to focus on the Mark of the Beast without identifying what the Bible says about receiving that mark.
  11. Standard membervivify
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    03 Sep '15 17:03
    Originally posted by twhitehead
    Why do you insist on that? I suspect you are saying that specifically to exclude cell phones and no other reason.
    It is perfectly reasonable to consider a cellphone to be a 'mark'. It is a uniquely identifying item that you keep on you at all times and is either in your right hand or by your ear (or in the case of Google Glass, on your forehead).
    You have a point.
  12. Standard membervivify
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    03 Sep '15 17:12
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    I think you are missing the point. The Mark of the Beast is an indication that the person is agreeeing to worship the Beast, or the Image of the Beast.

    The important thing in this is that those that are Christs will not worship the Beast which is demonstrated by receiving his Mark.

    Worship of the Beast = receiving of the Mark.

    Not receiving the Mar ...[text shortened]... ocus on the Mark of the Beast without identifying what the Bible says about receiving that mark.
    Your original point is basically that because no threats of death are happening *now* regarding the chip, that this isn't the Mark. No world threat springs up overnight, nor are they obvious threats at the beginning. The Nazi party was actually well respected prior to revealing their horrors, even by the British Royal Family.
  13. Standard memberavalanchethecat
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    03 Sep '15 17:26
    Originally posted by vivify
    True. It only says "receive". However, the only way to receive a "mark" would be for that mark to be attached to your body somehow (like a tattoo).
    Or an armband. Or a badge. Or a haircut. etc.
  14. Cape Town
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    03 Sep '15 17:35
    Originally posted by avalanchethecat
    Or an armband. Or a badge. Or a haircut. etc.
    Apple watch?
  15. Standard memberRajk999
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    03 Sep '15 18:09
    Originally posted by vivify
    Your original point is basically that because no threats of death are happening *now* regarding the chip, that this isn't the Mark. No world threat springs up overnight, nor are they obvious threats at the beginning. The Nazi party was actually well respected prior to revealing their horrors, even by the British Royal Family.
    Well I was making two points which has nothing to do with what type of mark or placement of the mark issues.

    The important thing is 'worship' of the beast or the image, otherwise there is threat of death.

    Is that a likely scenario where you are from?
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