Moral Codes and Self-Centered Beliefs regarding Adherence

Originally posted by KellyJay
I've said as much to you with scripture as well. Those that do not believe according to Jesus
are condemned already, those that do not pick up their crosses and follow Jesus are not
worthy of Him. We must do the works God gives us, and one of the first is to believe, to be
born again.

Whatever .. good luck to you.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Whatever .. good luck to you.

As I said, you reject anything from scripture given to you by others if it doesn't fit what you
believe, a dangerous place you are in.

Originally posted by Rajk999

I believe in what Christ and the Apostles said. You want me to believe in Sonships' interpretation of what they said.
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The Christian never graduates from living by and in FAITH. He never outgrows the need to walk by faith.

We walk [presently] by faith and not by sight.

"For we walk by faith and not by appearance ..." ( 2 Cor. 5:7)

This is not that we only BEGAN to walk by faith. But we CONTINUE on to walk by faith. And you say this is my personal interpretation.

Today after being a Christian for a few decades, I still must walk by faith.


The most important thing in the teachings of Christ and the Apostles is charitable love and good works.
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That requires faith in Christ. That requires that we take the indwelling Jesus Christ as the living One, the charitable One Who lives in the innermost part of the believer.

At the end of Paul's life and ministry filled with love for man and even his critics, he said he had KEPT the faith. He didn't say he outgrew it.

"I have fought the good fight; I have finished the course; I have kept the faith." (2 Tim. 7)

There is no hint that because charity was greater than faith to move mountains therefore faith became obsolete to him.

Paul instructs the serving deacons of the local churches to hold the mystery of the faith still.

"Deacons must similarly be grave, not double-tongued, not addicted to much wine, not greedy for base gain.

Holding the mystery of the faith in a pure conscience." ( 1 Tim. 3:9)

That is holding to the faith and not discarding, neglecting, or outgrowing. All of their service in love is through holding the mysterious nature of the faith.

And you accuse me of concocting a personal interpretation here.

The better translation of Romans 1:17 is that the just shall both have divine life and live in that divine life by faith.

Romans 1:17 [Recovery Version] - " For the righteousness of God is revealed in it out of faith to faith, as it iswritten, 'But the righteous shall have life and live by faith.' "

That is not only initially receive God's eternal life by faith but continue to walk by faith in order to live righteously in faith.

I can love not because I myself am so loving. I possess the Loving One of Jesus Christ in my spirit as the source of my Agape love. It is not I but Christ. And to live "not I but Christ" is to live in faith.

Christ is made to the Christian EVERYTHING in an all-inclusive way. He is made to us Christians "righteousness and sanctification and redemption so that we may BOAST not in what we have in ourselves but in the Lord Jesus. Right ?

"But of Him you are in Christ Jesus who became wisdom to us from God; both righteousness and sanctification and redemption,

That as it is written, 'He who boasts, let him boast in the Lord.' " ( 1 Cor. 1:30,31)

So we Christians need always to have FAITH that Christ within us can be everything we need. He is our wisdom. He is our righteousness, sanctification, and redemption. Our confidence is held in faith. And it must grow and expand until we either see the Lord or like Abraham, we die in faith.

You should not take Peter's letter to mean that faith is discarded.


It is NOT FAITH. I quoted many passages from Christ and all the apostles that says it.

So you believe what you like. I do not aspire to be like you people so I do not intend to pray and ask God to make me believe your doctrine.
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But the Apostle Jude said we SHOULD build up our most holy faith in prayer.

" But you beloved, building up yourselves upon your most holy faith, praying in the Holy Spirit." (Jude 20)

Don't you wish to pray and build up your spiritual being upon your most holy faith ? I certainly do.

Love is not opposed to faith. Rather the outflow of agape love is also through faith and in faith.

"Hold a pattern of healthy words that you have heard from me [Paul], in FAITH and LOVE which are in Christ Jesus." ( 2 Tim. 1:13)

Originally posted by Rajk999
If instead of disagreeing with sonship, I had agreed with what he said, there would have been no cause for you to advise me to pray over the issue now would there? Answer that question .. You would have been fine with my agreement.

Your suggestion for me to pray is to get me to think like you OSAS people...correct?

Do you understand how and why that ...[text shortened]... hrist does not support faith alone. Christ is about love and good works.. Get that in your head.

I was not playing dumb when I asked what "OSAS" meant. After some thought I believe
it is "once saved always saved", but if that is true why did you say it to me since it isn't
something I profess or believe in?

Originally posted by KellyJay
I was not playing dumb when I asked what "OSAS" meant. After some thought I believe
it is "once saved always saved", but if that is true why did you say it to me since it isn't
something I profess or believe in?

I think it really means 'once stupid, always stupid'.

Originally posted by sonhouse
I think it really means 'once stupid, always stupid'.

Could be, he said it, it meant something to him, it was new to me.