1. Standard memberRajk999
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    05 Jul '17 15:31
    So was Peter, James, John and Jude. None of them preached the truth about what happens to those whose names are not in the book of life. Apparently they are all tormented for eternity. So whose fault is it that none of them preached this doctrine to the Gentiles?

    What makes it worse is that rather than leaving the matter open or neutral, Paul had this advice to those who dont expect to be resurrected to be in the Kingdom of God. He supported the Epicurean principle - that they might as well eat, drink and be merry for tomorrow they die. Certainly Paul had a chance at this point to tell these people of the eternal torment they face.

    If after the manner of men
    I have fought with beasts at Ephesus,
    what advantageth it me, if the dead rise not?
    let us eat and drink; for to morrow we die.
    (1 Corinthians 15:32 KJV)


    Why did the Apostles not preach the truth of eternal torment?
  2. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Jul '17 02:26
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    So was Peter, James, John and Jude. None of them preached the truth about what happens to those whose names are not in the book of life. Apparently they are all tormented for eternity. So whose fault is it that none of them preached this doctrine to the Gentiles?

    What makes it worse is that rather than leaving the matter open or neutral, Paul had this ...[text shortened]...
    (1 Corinthians 15:32 KJV)[/i]

    Why did the Apostles not preach the truth of eternal torment?
    Apparently, they did.
  3. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Jul '17 02:28
    Rajk999: Why did the Apostles not preach the truth of eternal torment?

    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Apparently, they did.
    If you contend that the Apostles did preach "the truth of eternal torment", what do you understand to be the nature of that "eternal torment"?
  4. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Jul '17 02:38
    Originally posted by FMF
    If you contend that the Apostles did preach "the truth of eternal torment", what do you understand to be the nature of that "eternal torment"?
    At the risk of dancing to your tune, which is the only thing you think Christians are good for, I'll answer this question once, no matter how many times you'll try to entertain yourself by asking again and again and again.

    That it doesn't exist.
  5. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Jul '17 02:44
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    That it doesn't exist.
    And yet you have said that apparently the Apostles did preach "the truth of eternal torment". If, as you say, it doesn't exist, then in what sense is it "the truth"?
  6. SubscriberSuzianne
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    06 Jul '17 04:21
    Originally posted by FMF
    And yet you have said that apparently the Apostles did preach "the truth of eternal torment". If, as you say, it doesn't exist, then in what sense is it "the truth"?
    You're not the sharpest tool in the shed, are you?
  7. SubscriberFMF
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    06 Jul '17 04:531 edit
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    You're not the sharpest tool in the shed, are you?
    Did the Apostles preach "the truth" of eternal torment? Yes or no? You said yes. You said "Apparently, they did".

    Does eternal torment exist? Yes or no? You said no. You said "...it doesn't exist".

    So where does that leave "the truth" of what the Apostles preached?
  8. Standard memberwolfgang59
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    06 Jul '17 06:00
    Suzi & FMF - separated by a common language.
  9. Standard memberKellyJay
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    06 Jul '17 11:00
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    Apparently, they did.
    I wonder if he thinks John had anything to do with Jesus, since he wrote about it, or any
    of the writers of the gospels, since they quoted Jesus for us.
  10. Standard memberRajk999
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    06 Jul '17 11:171 edit
    Originally posted by KellyJay
    I wonder if he thinks John had anything to do with Jesus, since he wrote about it, or any
    of the writers of the gospels, since they quoted Jesus for us.
    Dumbo .. this is not about US, here and now who have a Bible. Try to focus on the post.

    Paul and the Apostles were sent to preach to the GENTILES, These Gentiles had no Bible except maybe for a Greek version of the Torah.

    The question is where in Pauls letters, did he explain to the GENTILES THEN AT THAT TIME, about the dire consequences of eternal torment of not knowing Christ etc? The word torment does not exist in Pauls letters.

    Focus on the topic instead of saying the first thing that comes to your head.
  11. Standard membersonship
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    07 Jul '17 04:177 edits
    Originally posted by Rajk999
    The question is where in Pauls letters, did he explain to the GENTILES THEN AT THAT TIME, about the dire consequences of eternal torment of not knowing Christ etc? The word torment does not exist in Pauls letters.


    In one of the earliest of his epistles Paul taught of eternal destruction and eternal judgment.

    "And to you who are being afflicted, rest with us at the revelation of the Lord Jesus from heaven with the angels of His power, in flaming fire,

    Rendering vengeance to those who do not know God and to those who do not obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ.

    They will pay the penalty of eternal destruction from the presence of the Lord and from the glory of His strength When He comes to be glorified in His saints ..." (See Second Thessalonians 1:7-10)


    I don't think Paul meant to pay the penalty of eternal non-existence.
    The phrase "eternal destruction" evokes something horrific upon these so condemned.

    No one should take a chance.
    Obey the Gospel of Christ to believe into Christ.
  12. SubscriberSuzianne
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    07 Jul '17 08:34
    Originally posted by FMF
    Did the Apostles preach "the truth" of eternal torment? Yes or no? You said yes. You said "Apparently, they did".

    Does eternal torment exist? Yes or no? You said no. You said "...it doesn't exist".

    So where does that leave "the truth" of what the Apostles preached?
    Yes. No. Do you have ANY idea what they DID preach?



    Look here, I'll try to make this easy on you.

    Maybe you'll even learn something about jumping on people without thinking.


    (Psssssst, you DO know that Rajk was being a bit sarcastic, yes?)

    The Apostles didn't preach about eternal torment because it doesn't exist. So therefore, they were preaching the "truth" of it, no?

    Really, how long do you have to go on posting on "auto-pilot" and "playing the woman"?

    Grow up.
  13. SubscriberSuzianne
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    07 Jul '17 08:40
    Originally posted by sonship
    The question is where in Pauls letters, did he explain to the GENTILES THEN AT THAT TIME, about the dire consequences of eternal torment of not knowing Christ etc? The word torment does not exist in Pauls letters.


    In one of the earliest of his epistles Paul taught of eternal destruction and eternal judgment.

    [quote] [b] "And to you ...[text shortened]... condemned.

    No one should take a chance.
    Obey the Gospel of Christ to believe into Christ.
    "eternal destruction"?

    What do you think this means?

    Is "destruction" the same as "torment"?

    No.

    "And fear not them which kill the body, but are not able to kill the soul: but rather fear him which is able to destroy both soul and body in hell." -- Matthew 10:28, KJV

    And THIS is "eternal destruction", not "eternal torment". And yeah, it's still horrific.
  14. SubscriberFMF
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    07 Jul '17 08:412 edits
    Originally posted by Suzianne
    The Apostles didn't preach about eternal torment because it doesn't exist.
    Do you believe they preached something different then from what sonship argues the Book of Revelation says?
  15. SubscriberSuzianne
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    07 Jul '17 08:59
    Originally posted by FMF
    Do you believe they preached something different then from what sonship argues the Book of Revelation says?
    Licking your wounds with a little "Christian on Christian" action, then? Pathetic.

    Sorry, I'm not playing.


    You really should pay a little more attention to what passes in front of your face when you come in here looking for Christians to maul. Sonship and I have already discussed (and argued about) the relevant bits of Revelation. And I'm not about to revisit it for your personal enjoyment.
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