Personal Relationship with Jesus

Originally posted by FMF
No, I am talking about not believing something. I am talking about someone realizing that they do not believe the content of the dogma. And I am talking about someone being honest about that. Dogma "not working for someone anymore" is just a figure of speech, whodey. It's about whether the "embrace" of dogma is genuine or whether it involves pretending.

What part of the dogma can you not embrace?

Originally posted by whodey
What part of the dogma can you not embrace?

The dogma is centred around the contention that "God" has revealed himself to you. I have no reason to believe He has. What's more, being a moral person does not rely on embracing the dogma, so there really is no need for me to pretend that I am embracing it. I don't embrace Islamic or Buddhist dogma either, or any religionist folklore or doctrine.

Originally posted by FMF
The dogma is centred around the contention that "God" has revealed himself to you. I have no reason to believe He has. What's more, being a moral person does not rely on embracing the dogma, so there really is no need for me to pretend that I am embracing it. I don't embrace Islamic or Buddhist dogma either, or any religionist folklore or doctrine.

I rather enjoy reading John chapter 6. In it, Jesus tells the multitude that he is the bread of life. Then the crowd begins to disperse and leave. However, Jesus does not back track and try the apologist route. Instead, he offends them further and says that unless they eat his flesh and drink his blood, a clear violation of the Mosaic law, they can have no part of him. Why is he doing this?

In the end, the 12 are left and no one else. Jesus then looks up and asks if they will leave as well. Then Peter says, "Lord, to whom shall we go? You have the words of eternal life." That is pretty much how I feel about things. No one approaches the realm of Jesus.

In the end, their love for Jesus and their subsequent internal confirmation that he speaks the truth is what God is looking for no matter the cost to us personally. The Bible is full of such examples, such as Abraham told to go sacrifice his son on a mountain or Stephen giving his life for the gospel. At some point we will be tested to see what we hold dear to our hearts. Is it God, or something or someone else?

Originally posted by whodey
That is pretty much how I feel about things. No one approaches the realm of Jesus.

If it works for you, then all well and good. I don't subscribe to it.

At some point we will be tested to see what we hold dear to our hearts. Is it God, or something or someone else?

It is your prerogative to make assertions about what will and will not happen "at some point", and about being "tested". It is also entirely up to you to decide what you "hold dear to [your] heart".

Originally posted by whodey
I rather enjoy reading John chapter 6. In it, Jesus tells the multitude that he is the bread of life. Then the crowd begins to disperse and leave. However, Jesus does not back track and try the apologist route. Instead, he offends them further and says that unless they eat his flesh and drink his blood, a clear violation of the Mosaic law, they can have n ...[text shortened]... ll be tested to see what we hold dear to our hearts. Is it God, or something or someone else?

I am not as good at offending the unbelievers as Jesus, but I enjoy trying to offend them so they despise me. Let them hate me, like Jesus was hated. Let them accuse me of all manner of evil for His sake. I hope to get approval and love from all believers for speaking out for the truth. But most of all I seek the approval from Christ Jesus, because I already know he loves me.

HalleluYah !!! Praise the Lord! Holy! Holy! Holy!

Originally posted by RJHinds
I am not as good at offending the unbelievers as Jesus, but I enjoy trying to offend them so they despise me. Let them hate me, like Jesus was hated. Let them accuse me of all manner of evil for His sake. I hope to get approval and love from all believers for speaking out for the truth. But most of all I seek the approval from Christ Jesus, because I already know he loves me.

I hope to get approval and love from all believers for speaking out for the truth.

Do you feel as if you "get [the] approval and love from all believers" that you hope for here in this RHP community?

Originally posted by FMF
[b]I hope to get approval and love from all believers for speaking out for the truth.

Do you feel as if you "get [the] approval and love from all believers" that you hope for here in this RHP community?[/b]

No. But I have hope that they will come around in time.

Originally posted by RJHinds
No. But I have hope that they will come around in time.

Why do you think you don't get their approval and love?

Originally posted by FMF
Why do you think you don't get their approval and love?

I am a different kind of Christian and some do not understand my methods because it is not their way.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I am a different kind of Christian and some do not understand my methods because it is not their way.

If it is "not their way", what makes you think that simply repeating an approach, which you concede hasn't worked for you, will eventually succeed?

Originally posted by FMF
If it is "not their way", what makes you think that simply repeating an approach, which you concede hasn't worked for you, will eventually succeed?

I have no assurance, only hope.

Originally posted by RJHinds
I have no assurance, only hope.

In any other aspect of your adult life, has deliberately trying to make people despise you ever succeeded in persuading other people to love you? Perhaps you could cite a personal example of it working for you, so that the basis of your "hope" might be better understood.

Originally posted by FMF
In any other aspect of your adult life, has deliberately trying to make people despise you ever succeeded in persuading other people to love you? Perhaps you could cite a personal example of it working for you, so that the basis of your "hope" might be better understood.

The apostle Paul said, "For we walk by faith, not by sight."

(2 Corinthians 5:7 NKJV)

No, I have not seen it happen.

Originally posted by RJHinds
No, I have not seen it happen.

It seems to me that what you have been describing is simply a mixture of vanity and victimhood. This would be a psychological issue rather than a spiritual one, I reckon.

Originally posted by RJHinds
The apostle Paul said, "For we walk by faith, not by sight."
(2 Corinthians 5:7 NKJV)

I'm a hard-core hiker. When the path is unclear, people have walked off cliffs.

How can we know that the gods aren't hungry and want to eat souls? Walk off the cliff and find out?