Originally posted by FMFLook forward to a few relaxed chess games, together, at a corner table upstairs in the Celestial Chess Club (for patzers) in Heaven. I'll bring the wine.
I understand what you say. I am fully aware of what you Christians tell yourselves. While it is your prerogative to do so in a forum like this, telling it to me does not add any credence to what you believe.
Originally posted by FMFI've not changed my point of view on that point either, if you actually had a
And yet this not-being-the-same-as-you thing made you take it upon yourself to declare me never-a-Christian. Now you say that everyone has different relationships. I seem to have caught you kind of making it up as you go along. But don't worry, I've faced a fair bit of fumbling irritated denunciation from still-Christians on account of being an ex-one.
relationship with God through Jesus Christ, than you'd never be able to deny it.
If you never had a real one of course you could deny it, since it was never real to
begin with.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayWe have been all through this extraordinarily conceited estimation of yourself before. I did have one: every bit as "real" as yours, albeit different - for the reasons you gave. But I stopped believing. I do not deny that I used to be a Christian just like you are.
I've not changed my point of view on that point either, if you actually had a
relationship with God through Jesus Christ, than you'd never be able to deny it.
Originally posted by FMFYes, we have been through this before...I've no desire to do it again.
We have been all through this extraordinarily conceited estimation of yourself before. I did have one: every bit as "real" as yours, albeit different - for the reasons you gave. But I stopped believing. I do not deny that I used to be a Christian just like you are.
I'll just say truth in the end will carry the day if I'm right or wrong.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayOne wonders why you feel the need to declare a person was or wasn't in the past. It's a form of misanthropy I think. You'd deny it of course. And it's your faith that makes you that way. One wonders why you need to project your so called "truth" on to me and what bearing it has on your feelings about your own faith. Your whole routine over this matter smacks of insecurity. I have the common decency to take you at your word when you talk about your beliefs and say you are a Christian, and you find it difficult to exhibit the same common decency to take me at my word when I tell you what my beliefs were in the past. Whatever floats your boats, I suppose.
Yes, we have been through this before...I've no desire to do it again.
I'll just say truth in the end will carry the day if I'm right or wrong.
Kelly
Originally posted by FMFThe need is simple, Jesus said He was the Way, the Truth, the Life and no one
One wonders why you feel the need to declare a person was or wasn't in the past. It's a form of misanthropy I think. You'd deny it of course. And it's your faith that makes you that way. One wonders why you need to project your so called "truth" on to me and what bearing it has on your feelings about your own faith. Your whole routine over this matter smacks of ...[text shortened]... d when I tell you what my beliefs were in the past. Whatever floats your boats, I suppose.
comes to the Father except through Him. Missing out of the forgiveness of Christ
means you run into the wrath of God instead, I don't want anyone to go through
that. Jesus paid to high a price so we could be forgiven, and the fate awaiting
sinners wihtout God's grace isn't a good one.
Kelly
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Originally posted by FMFIt boils down to what is and is not a Christian. If all you think a Christian is, is one
I used to be a Christian. I am not anymore. What is it that makes you need to declare I was never a Christian?
that says they are, or one that believes X,Y, and Z than that is what a Christian is
and you can be one by either of those standards. If a Christian is one that actually
gets saved by the grace of God through Jesus Christ that now can call God Father
due to God's grace has invited Christ into his or her life so that they now have a
relationship with God, then no I don't think you ever were. Reason being if you
actually had a relationship with God, you would not be able to turn around later
and say it really didn't happen. If it really didn't happen, than it really did not
happen which makes your claiims different from those that acknowledge God in
their lives.
Kelly
Originally posted by KellyJayBut it did happen, as I have said over and over again. I am not saying "it really didn't happen". No need for you to put words in my mouth; my own are clear enough. Are you seriously claiming that someone cannot lose their faith?
Reason being if you actually had a relationship with God, you would not be able to turn around later and say it really didn't happen.
Originally posted by FMFSo you had a personal relationship with God through Jesus Christ, and you do not
But it did happen, as I have said over and over again. I am not saying "it really didn't happen". No need for you to put words in my mouth; my own are clear enough. Are you seriously claiming that someone cannot lose their faith?
now, because you no longer believe in it. That pretty much covers it in my opinion.
We have gone over this several times now, all I'm doing is repeating myself, if
you don't grasp my point now you never will.
Kelly