PM from KOP

RajK,
In one of my posts it may have seemed like that I was saying, "woe to" you or seemed like I was calling you a hypocrite. Will you not take those 2 things as if I was calling them out to you. Christ called that out to the Pharisees.

The Pharisees were depending on their idea of righteousness to get them to heaven. The Lord Jesus was telling them that they were incorrect. They also rejected Jesus as the Savior for all of Israel. So, in the end, what will they have to show for their souls if they reject Jesus as Messiah? God gave them a Messiah, and they rejected Him. What can be a defense against them being rejected from Life?

King James Version
==========================
John 1: 1-4, 11, 12
In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.

The same was in the beginning with God.

All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

He came unto his own, and his own received him not.

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Salvation for our souls is in Jesus the Christ, and not in the deeds of the Law of God.

King James Version
========================
John 1: 4, 12, 13
In him was life; and the life was the light of men.

But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name:

Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.

I John 5:10-11
He that believeth on the Son of God hath the witness in himself: he that believeth not God hath made him a liar; because he believeth not the record that God gave of his Son.

And this is the record, that God hath given to us eternal life, and this life is in his Son.

I John 5:20
And we know that the Son of God is come, and hath given us an understanding, that we may know him that is true, and we are in him that is true, even in his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God, and eternal life.

Originally posted by KingOnPoint
RajK,
I posted another posting for you to consider? Will you respond?

You have said nothing worth responding to.

Let me remind you how these threads got started. You sent me a message which contained two questions. I took those two questions, [which apparently you thought could not be answered] started two threads and gave you an answer. I still wait for your response to my answers.

Maybe really don't know what Christ said about eternal life? If that's the case I suggest you read the first 4 books of the New Testament.

Originally posted by Rajk999
You have said nothing worth responding to.

Let me remind you how these threads got started. You sent me a message which contained two questions. I took those two questions, [which apparently you thought could not be answered] started two threads and gave you an answer. I still wait for your response to my answers.

Maybe really don't know what Christ s ...[text shortened]... bout eternal life? If that's the case I suggest you read the first 4 books of the New Testament.

With the type of responses you've received from KoP and GB, I think about the following scenario:

A basketball coach at various times and in various ways has told his players that in order to be assured success that they must develop exceptional skills, that they must attain an exceptional level of fitness and that they must believe in themselves.

One can only shake ones head at those who think that they need only establish a belief in themselves in order to be assured success and insist that "coach said that I can be assured success if I believe in myself" whenever someone points out that they must also develop exceptional skills and attain an exceptional level of fitness in order to be assured success.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
With the type of responses you've received from KoP and GB, I think about the following scenario:

A basketball coach at various times and in various ways has told his players that in order to be assured success that they must develop exceptional skills, that they must attain an exceptional level of fitness and that they must believe in themselves.

O ...[text shortened]... op exceptional skills and attain an exceptional level of fitness in order to be assured success.

A good analogy. I hope they can see your point.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
With the type of responses you've received from KoP and GB, I think about the following scenario:

A basketball coach at various times and in various ways has told his players that in order to be assured success that they must develop exceptional skills, that they must attain an exceptional level of fitness and that they must believe in themselves.

O ...[text shortened]... op exceptional skills and attain an exceptional level of fitness in order to be assured success.

The difference is that one can not work hard enough to gain eternal life. Only God can do that and He wants faith and belief in Him. The scriptures says that without faith it is impossible to please God.


Hebrews 11:6

New King James Version (NKJV)

But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.

Originally posted by RJHinds
The difference is that one can not work hard enough to gain eternal life. Only God can do that and He wants faith and belief in Him. The scriptures says that without faith it is impossible to please God.


Hebrews 11:6

New King James Version (NKJV)

[b]But without faith it is impossible to please Him, for he who comes to God must believe that He is, and that He is a rewarder of those who diligently seek Him.
[/b]

From what I gather, Rajk is only speaking against "faith alone" doctrine. If you reread the OP you'll see that he was answering KoP's request for a passage that indicates that something more than faith is required for "eternal life". Rajk fulfilled that request.

Seems that instead of actually addressing the import of the passage that Rajk cited, the "faith alone" crowd has been unable to do little more than reiterate that faith is required - much like in the scenario I gave.

Originally posted by Rajk999
A good analogy. I hope they can see your point.

If RJ's post is any indication, things don't look promising.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
From what I gather, Rajk is only speaking against "faith alone" doctrine. If you reread the OP you'll see that he was answering KoP's request for a passage that indicates that something more than faith is required for "eternal life". Rajk fulfilled that request.

Seems that instead of actually addressing the import of the passage that Rajk cited, the " ...[text shortened]... able to do little more than reiterate that faith is required - much like in the scenario I gave.

As I understand him, what he is saying is doing works is required to be saved. What I am trying to point out is that for those that do no works or for those unable to do the works, that their faith is counted for righteousness; and then they are saved by the grace of God because of their faith and not because of their works lest any man boast that he has done more good works.

I am not saying doing good works is not important. Certainly we will be rewarded for our good works.

Originally posted by RJHinds
As I understand him, what he is saying is doing works is required to be saved. What I am trying to point out is that for those that do no works or for those unable to do the works, that their faith is counted for righteousness; and then they are saved by the grace of God because of their faith and not because of their works lest any man boast that he has done more good works.

I think I understand "faith alone" doctrine. I understand that that is your belief.

However, there still is the matter of the passage cited by Rajk in the OP. Why don't you directly address it instead of continuing to reiterate "faith alone" doctrine?

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
I think I understand "faith alone" doctrine. I understand that that is your belief.

However, there still is the matter of the passage cited by Rajk in the OP. Why don't you directly address it instead of continuing to reiterate "faith alone" doctrine?

Do you mean this one?

And, behold, a certain lawyer stood up, and tempted him, saying, Master, what shall I do to inherit eternal life? He said unto him, What is written in the law? how readest thou? And he answering said, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy strength, and with all thy mind; and thy neighbour as thyself. And he said unto him, Thou hast answered right: this do, and thou shalt live.

(Luke 10:25-28 KJV)

If so, I did directly addressed that, but it might have been in another thread. I told him he stopped quoting too soon and then explained with other verses.

Rajk999 also referred to the letter by James on faith and works. This is the way I explain that:

James is speaking of faith in general. The fallen angels or demons , as James points out, apparently believed in the existence of the one God, but they put their faith in Satan instead. This is false faith. That kind of faith that is without good works is dead. The demons can not do pleasing works to God because their faith is in the wrong thing. James believed that the good works he did showed that he had true faith.

Paul was speaking of true faith in Jesus as our Lord and Savior. Only the persons having this kind of faith can please God by doing good works. But we are saved by faith, not works, so nobody can boast. But after being saved by the grace of God through our faith, we will be rewarded in heaven based on our good works.

Now if anyone builds on this foundation with gold, silver, precious stones, wood, hay, straw, each one’s work will become clear; for the Day will declare it, because it will be revealed by fire; and the fire will test each one’s work, of what sort it is. If anyone’s work which he has built on it endures, he will receive a reward.

1 Corinthians 3:12-14

New King James Version (NKJV)

If anyone’s work is burned, he will suffer loss; but he himself will be saved, yet so as through fire.

1 Corinthians 3:15 NKJV)

I guess you know the foundation is our belief and faith in Jesus as our Savior.

I am still around. I have been preparing for responding to ThinkOfOne. However, for a person to think that his or her own good works justify his or her sinful nature is off. A person is a sinner destined for hell and/or the Lake of Fire until he or she is born again.

This regeneration doesn't come from completing enough good works, but a spiritual transformation by God's work.

A human being in himself or herself can never be as good as God unless God transforms that person. In ourselves we can never be holy or righteous as God because our sin has broken the relationship we could have had. The relationship has to be repaired. Only Christ Himself can do that. We cannot make up for sinning our own sin. Once we have broken God's Law, it is forever done. Someone had to pay for the sin. The question do we want God's forgiveness through Christ's sacrifice or do we want to "try" to work our way to heaven.

Man's goodness in himself is worthless to God. God justification is a spiritual transformation and NOT a human struggle. The purpose of good works is not to get to heaven. One purpose for good works is to please a Sinless and Holy God.

Why was the greatest prophet up till Christ, John the Baptist, so unworthy if he was so righteous, if he was so sinless, if he was so just? With all his "goodness" he was not worthy enough to even unloose Christ's shoe's latchet.

King James Version
====================
Isaiah 64:6
But we are all as an unclean thing, and all our righteousnesses are as filthy rags; and we all do fade as a leaf; and our iniquities, like the wind, have taken us away.

Psalm 103: 1-14
Bless the LORD, O my soul: and all that is within me, bless his holy name.

Bless the LORD, O my soul, and forget not all his benefits:

Who forgiveth all thine iniquities; who healeth all thy diseases;

Who redeemeth thy life from destruction; who crowneth thee with lovingkindness and tender mercies;

Who satisfieth thy mouth with good things; so that thy youth is renewed like the eagle's.

The LORD executeth righteousness and judgment for all that are oppressed.

He made known his ways unto Moses, his acts unto the children of Israel.

The LORD is merciful and gracious, slow to anger, and plenteous in mercy.

He will not always chide: neither will he keep his anger for ever.

He hath not dealt with us after our sins; nor rewarded us according to our iniquities.

For as the heaven is high above the earth, so great is his mercy toward them that fear him.

As far as the east is from the west, so far hath he removed our transgressions from us.

Like as a father pitieth his children, so the LORD pitieth them that fear him.

For he knoweth our frame; he remembereth that we are dust.

John 1: 25-27, 29
And they asked him, and said unto him, Why baptizest thou then, if thou be not that Christ, nor Elias, neither that prophet?

John answered them, saying, I baptize with water: but there standeth one among you, whom ye know not;

He it is, who coming after me is preferred before me, whose shoe's latchet I am not worthy to unloose.

The next day John seeth Jesus coming unto him, and saith, Behold the Lamb of God, which taketh away the sin of the world.

To all who think that you must keep the Law of God to get to heaven. Read Acts 15 in the King James version of the holy bible. If Jesus thought that his "demands" were a light burden and an easy yoke and a rest unto people's souls, then why did Peter say in Acts 15, "a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?"

Certainly circumcision is not that hard. I don't even remember being circumcised as an American child. So, why did Peter think that only circumcision was so hard to bear? Could it be that the whole Law of God is what Peter was actually talking about rather than just circumcision?

You people that think that all the Law of God must be kept to get to heaven, why did Christ not stone the adulterous woman in front of all and yet still fulfill the Law of God? Why was David the King of Israel not stoned for his adultery? Why did God Himself not take David's life? If the Law of God must be kept, then who is at fault for David still living? Was it Nathan the prophet? God is sure not to blame. Yet, God spared David's life. Did Christ think that the "whole" Law of God was not a burden too hard for a human being to bear?

Against David, the King , the Law of God was not followed and yet David was a man after God's own heart. How can God have mercy or grace if the Law of God offers none?

Please people, try to keep the whole Law of God and see how long you can last. Do you think that the whole Law of God is not a burden at all? Read all of God's Law and try to follow it. But before you die, accept Christ Himself as your personal Savior before it is too late to be given eternal life.



King James Version
======================
Matthew 11: 28-30
Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest.

Take my yoke upon you, and learn of me; for I am meek and lowly in heart: and ye shall find rest unto your souls.

For my yoke is easy, and my burden is light.

Acts 15: 1, 6-11
And certain men which came down from Judaea taught the brethren, and said, Except ye be circumcised after the manner of Moses, ye cannot be saved.

And the apostles and elders came together for to consider of this matter.

And when there had been much disputing, Peter rose up, and said unto them, Men and brethren, ye know how that a good while ago God made choice among us, that the Gentiles by my mouth should hear the word of the gospel, and believe.

And God, which knoweth the hearts, bare them witness, giving them the Holy Ghost, even as he did unto us;

And put no difference between us and them, purifying their hearts by faith.

Now therefore why tempt ye God, to put a yoke upon the neck of the disciples, which neither our fathers nor we were able to bear?

But we believe that through the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ we shall be saved, even as they.

RajK,
Why did Christ think that He could give a person eternal life? Why did Christ think that He could forgive sins? What was the purpose of Christ taking on the sin of the world, if all we have to do is keep the Law of God to gain eternal life? Do you think that Christ was wrong about His purposes for mankind? Again, was Christ telling us that there are 2 ways to have eternal life?

I still want to answer you. Will you answer these most recent questions? It is your soul and others that may be in jeopardy. Even if you hold on to your belief about gaining eternal life through good works, there is still another part of the 4 gospels that tell of gaining eternal life through believing in Christ as Savior that you are ignoring.