Originally posted by receda First things first. Satan was never lucifer. The image never changed. We have different names for him, but he's still the same entity. Second, God never willed Lucifer into being to hold an equilibriam in the master plan. Lucifer was Saint Lucious, God's right hand man. He didn't have free will but he was jelous of Man. He foresake Man for taking God's attent ...[text shortened]... l. Thirdly, religion is fiction. Great story but never to be believed. Tolkien wrote better.
Originally posted by FreakyKBH Well, there you go again. For some odd reason, you often (repeatedly, consistently) confuse God's will with God's desires. Oh, well, you'll figure it out someday, I'm sure.
god is (apparently) omnipotent. Whatever his desire is, would just be.
Actually, thinking about it, since god is apperently omnipotent and omniscient everything that ever happens was preempted by god and he put the conditions in place that makes everything happen, with perfect foreknowledge.
So for every rape and murder we can ultimately blame god.
Originally posted by Churlant Why is that? You have already indicated Satan will not be saved, so what is the point of allowing him to continue causing pain and misery?
Originally posted by scottishinnz god is (apparently) omnipotent. Whatever his desire is, would just be.
Actually, thinking about it, since god is apperently omnipotent and omniscient everything that ever happens was preempted by god and he put the conditions in place that makes everything happen, with perfect foreknowledge.
So for every rape and murder we can ultimately blame god.
So, by this logic I should lobotomize my children, hence preventing them from doing anything 'bad'. After all, they are my creation and I am responsible for them. I am able to prevent them from doing any 'sins', therefore I must. That is, atleast, if I am moral.
For that matter, perhaps I should simply destroy them. That also prevents them from exerting individual will to do things opposing to my will and what is 'good'. This solution also prevents any unnecessary consumption of resources and use of space.
Originally posted by receda Now in our modern forward thinking times, we are able to pick apart the story and find faults. Eg. men don't have 1 less rib so God never created Eve from Adam's rib. Adam's apple... How else do you describe the meaning of temptation to a group of desert dwellers. A crisp cold juicy apple. All fiction full of flaws.
How do you know Eve wasn't created with one less rib than Adam was created with, so that afterwards they matched? 🙄
Originally posted by scottishinnz god is (apparently) omnipotent. Whatever his desire is, would just be.
Actually, thinking about it, since god is apperently omnipotent and omniscient everything that ever happens was preempted by god and he put the conditions in place that makes everything happen, with perfect foreknowledge.
So for every rape and murder we can ultimately blame god.
You're quite fond of a clockwork universe, I see. What an incredibly depressing thought.
Originally posted by receda Now in our modern forward thinking times, we are able to pick apart the story and find faults. Eg. men don't have 1 less rib so God never created Eve from Adam's rib. Adam's apple... How else do you describe the meaning of temptation to a group of desert dwellers. A crisp cold juicy apple. All fiction full of flaws.
No where does it say apple, at least know the story before you
start telling everyone how bad it is.
Kelly
Originally posted by FreakyKBH [b]If Satan came to accept God and offered true repentance for the choices he has made, he would be forgiven - at least according to the Bible. Unfortunately, not a possibility, and certainly not supported by the Bible.[/b]
You present yourself a catch-22 in this instance. First you claim God is allowing Satan an "appeals process", which seems to indicate He is giving Satan the opportunity to recognize his errors and redeem himself in the eyes of the Lord.
Now you claim this is impossible, despite God's apparent offering. Scripture certainly does support the concept of being redeemed for any sin (while simultaneously claiming an "unpardonable sin", but we don't need to delve there just yet).
Originally posted by Omnislash So, by this logic I should lobotomize my children, hence preventing them from doing anything 'bad'. After all, they are my creation and I am responsible for them. I am able to prevent them from doing any 'sins', therefore I must. That is, atleast, if I am moral.
For that matter, perhaps I should simply destroy them. That also prevents them from exertin ...[text shortened]... nnecessary consumption of resources and use of space.
Do I follow our logic correctly?
Only if you have perfect foreknowledge that they will sin, and it cannot be prevented any other way (if god knows something will happen, then by definition it must). Oh, and an important bit is, I suppose, is the punishment for the crime the commit must be worse than being lobotomised. I mean, god sends you to hell forever - pretty mean stuff for having a fantasy about your neighbours wife. No half measures for this deity....
Originally posted by scottishinnz I mean, god sends you to hell forever - pretty mean stuff for having a fantasy about your neighbours wife. No half measures for this deity....
Either is someone is perfect or they're not. You can't be half-perfect and half earn your way into heaven. Same as you can't be half-pregnant.
Praying for Satan
14 May '06 02:16
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