Originally posted by checkbaiter
Who are you addressing?

It was meant for Rajk999 the starter of the thread,
Sorry for the ambiguity.

Originally posted by Grampy Bobby
"Read the Whole Thing .. Dammit !" "For by grace are you saved through faith, and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God, not as a result of works, that no one should boast." (Ephesians 2:8-9) / "He who believes in the Son has eternal life; he who does not believe in the Son shall not see life but the wrath of God abides on him." (John 3:36) / “F ...[text shortened]... y born*] Son, that whoever believes in Him shall not perish, but have eternal life." (John 3:16)

And that is the whole thing? What about:

For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
(2 Peter 2:20-21 KJV)

James 2:20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?

James 2:14 What doth it profit, my brethren, though a man say he hath faith, and have not works? can faith save him?

And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments. He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him. But whoso keepeth his word, in him verily is the love of God perfected: hereby know we that we are in him. (1 John 2:3-5 KJV)

Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels: For I was an hungred, and ye gave me no meat: I was thirsty, and ye gave me no drink: I was a stranger, and ye took me not in: naked, and ye clothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. (Matthew 25:41-43 KJV)


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Originally posted by Rajk999
And that is the whole thing? What about:

For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning. For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they ...[text shortened]... lothed me not: sick, and in prison, and ye visited me not. (Matthew 25:41-43 KJV)


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Is your entire Christian outlook reactionary towards other believers ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Well said? Because it supports your view?

Are you not ignoring the parts of the Bible that say the the very same Abraham was JUSTIFIED BY WORKS? God can and will justify many by works. It is in the Bible even though you seem not to want to accept it. The topic is "Read the Whole Thing .. Dammit !"

But I agree that it is not your business, neither is it mine.

Post those scriptures we can talk about them.

Originally posted by Rajk999
What is your view of Romans 2?

Its the Word of God.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Post those scriptures we can talk about them.

I just did. Talk

Originally posted by sonship
Is your entire Christian outlook reactionary towards other believers ?

You are arrogant and rude. Go find another thread to infect with your false osas doctrine of devils.

Originally posted by Rajk999
I just did. Talk

Okay, not sure what you are looking for. We will be judged by our works, we will be known
by our works, we will be sinners due to our works. You have a point? We will follow and
obey the Lord by doing works He calls good, where the Holy Spirit leads we will follow,
we will be guided by the Holy Spirit, and we will be saved by Jesus Christ by faith not works
least any boast, if we are working for our salvation that would turn God grace into
a pay check not grace.

Originally posted by twhitehead
And that is the problem right there. You are assuming that there was a historical figure and that his words were preserved. Why?

[b]Now each biographer might only have access to a subset of those words or choose only those words that best prop up the mythology that they are trying to convey.
Or invent words as might suit his message.

The bes ...[text shortened]... think Jesus was a real person or if he was that the words reported as being his were really his.

Let's set Jesus aside for a moment and concentrate on the thought experiment itself.

Do you agree with the following? If not, why not?

The best way to derive the underlying themes and concepts of the historical figure would be [to] take the words out of context of each biographers mythology and analyze them in their entirety.

Analyzing them solely within the context of each biographer's mythology would yield the themes and concepts of each biographer.

Originally posted by KellyJay
Okay, not sure what you are looking for. We will be judged by our works, we will be known
by our works, we will be sinners due to our works. You have a point? We will follow and
obey the Lord by doing works He calls good, where the Holy Spirit leads we will follow,
we will be guided by the Holy Spirit, and we will be saved by Jesus Christ by faith not wo ...[text shortened]... oast, if we are working for our salvation that would turn God grace into
a pay check not grace.

Not everyone who claims to have faith will follow and obey God or Christ.
Faith must be demonstrated and proven.
Faith without works is dead.
Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Some have been given the power of the holy spirit and have abused it.
Those are my points. All of the above is in the Bible,

Most of all absolutely NOTHING you said is from Christ.

Originally posted by Rajk999
Not everyone who claims to have faith will follow and obey God or Christ.
Faith must be demonstrated and proven.
Faith without works is dead.
Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Some have been given the power of the holy spirit and have abused it.
Those are my points. All of the above is in the Bible,

Most of all absolutely NOTHING you said is from Christ.

It does not matter to me what they do and do not do, if you belong to God in Christ and are
following Him you'll be saved. People can claim to be and do anything, none of our claims
or efforts really matter, only what Jesus did for us and how we respond to Him. If we claim
to know God and refuse to follow Him, than that will be painfully clear in the end.

Working out our own salvation is between us and God, that is not saying we are to work
for our salvation. We are to enter into His rest, salvation is a gift, and from there we will
do works of God.

It is one thing to work out of love another to work for a pay check.

So do you believe anyone can be saved by works apart from Jesus Christ?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Not everyone who claims to have faith will follow and obey God or Christ.
Faith must be demonstrated and proven.
Faith without works is dead.
Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Some have been given the power of the holy spirit and have abused it.
Those are my points. All of the above is in the Bible,

Most of all absolutely NOTHING you said is from Christ.

"Some have been given the power of the holy spirit and have abused it."

What do you mean by this, someone can abuse God?

Originally posted by Rajk999
Not everyone who claims to have faith will follow and obey God or Christ.
Faith must be demonstrated and proven.
Faith without works is dead.
Work out your own salvation with fear and trembling.
Some have been given the power of the holy spirit and have abused it.
Those are my points. All of the above is in the Bible,

Most of all absolutely NOTHING you said is from Christ.

I can give scripture for my points too, and will if you request them.

Originally posted by ThinkOfOne
Let's set Jesus aside for a moment and concentrate on the thought experiment itself.

Do you agree with the following? If not, why not?

The best way to derive the underlying themes and concepts of the historical figure would be [to] take the words out of context of each biographers mythology and analyze them in their entirety.

Analyzing them ...[text shortened]... each biographer's mythology would yield the themes and concepts of each biographer.

I don't know about twhitehead but I don't agree.

The reason is that you essentially have four different people telling versions of [supposedly] the same story.

If you are going to try to pick apart the differences in meaning and motive etc between the authors you need
to analyse each story individually before trying to compare and contrast the stories.

Where the stories flatly contradict each other [and they do here] you can't just average between them.

You can see where the points of agreement are, but that leaves you still with all the disagreements.

Originally posted by Rajk999
You are arrogant and rude. Go find another thread to infect with your false osas doctrine of devils.

Read the Whole Thing .. Dammit !

One of the New Testament commands is:

" Let no corrupt word proceed out of your mouth, but only that which is good for building up, according to the need , that it may give grace to those who hear." (Ephesians 4:29)

Rajk999, keeping the commands of the New Testament is important, you know?