Spirituality

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
[1]Which claims in particular don't you find credible? [2]Also do you think that people who do find them credible do so out of ignorance?

[1] Pretty much anything other than the fact that he was a maverick rabbi who was executed, for all intents and purposes, for sedition. [2] No.

Originally posted by FMF
[1] Pretty much anything other than the fact that he was a maverick rabbi who was executed, for all intents and purposes, for sedition. [2] No.

If someone were to reach a different conclusion to you, would you say they are wrong?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
If someone were to reach a different conclusion to you, would you say they are wrong?

I certainly think you are sadly mistaken if you think you are going to live on forever after you die, but if it gives you solace and purpose in your life, good for you, as I have said before. Why "sadly"? Well I think that, when people settle for curiosity-suffocating prefabricated packages of "answers" that retail religions provide, they are selling themselves - and their potential and capacity for spiritual exploration - short, sadly so. But if it floats your boat, good luck to you.

Originally posted by FMF
I certainly think you are sadly mistaken if you think you are going to live on forever after you die, but if it gives you solace and purpose in your life, good for you, as I have said before. Why "sadly"? Well I think that, when people settle for curiosity-suffocating prefabricated packages of "answers" that retail religions provide, they are selling themselves ...[text shortened]... acity for spiritual exploration - short, sadly so. But if it floats your boat, good luck to you.

I was asking whether you thought that people who reached a different conclusion to you about who Jesus was are wrong?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
I was asking whether you thought that people who reached a different conclusion to you about who Jesus was are wrong?

And I answered you. You believe following Jesus means you will live on forever in the afterlife, right? Did you not read my post?

Originally posted by FMF
And I answered you. You believe following Jesus means you will live on forever in the afterlife, right? Did you not read my post?

I said nothing about following Jesus. Do you think that people who reach a different conclusion to you about who Jesus was are wrong? Yes or No?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
I said nothing about following Jesus.

I thought you believe that following Jesus means you will live on forever in the afterlife. Do you think this can happen without following Jesus?

Originally posted by FMF
I thought you believe that following Jesus means you will live on forever in the afterlife. Do you think this can happen without following Jesus?

Do you think that people who reach a different conclusion to you about who Jesus was are wrong? Yes or No?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
I said nothing about following Jesus. Do you think that people who reach a different conclusion to you about who Jesus was are wrong? Yes or No?

OK, well the same answer applies. So here it is again with the different words inserted and a few words added:

I certainly think - from my point of view, and based on my beliefs - that you are sadly mistaken if you reach a different conclusion to me about who Jesus, but it is in many cases a harmless preoccupation (indeed it is very often an extremely positive and rewarding one). If it gives you comfort and meaning in your life, good for you, as I have often said before.

Why do I "sadly"? Well I think that, when people settle for curiosity-suffocating prefabricated packages of "answers" that retail religions provide, they are selling short, not only themselves, but also they are, to my way of thinking, squandering their spiritual potential and capacity. But if it pushes your buttons, then good luck to you.

Originally posted by FMF
OK, well the same answer applies. So here it is again with the different words inserted and a few words added:

I certainly think - from my point of view, and based on my beliefs - that you are sadly mistaken if you reach a different conclusion to me about who Jesus, but it is in many cases a harmless preoccupation (indeed it is very often an extremely positiv ...[text shortened]... ng their spiritual potential and capacity. But if it pushes your buttons, then good luck to you.

I certainly think - from my point of view, and based on my beliefs - that you are sadly mistaken if you reach a different conclusion to me about who Jesus was.

So from your point of view what information have I missed or am I not privy to that has allowed me to incorrectly reach the wrong conclusion regarding who Jesus really was?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
So from your point of view what information have I missed or am I not privy to that has allowed me to incorrectly reach the wrong conclusion regarding who Jesus really was?

What on earth are you on about? Look, I don't believe the same things as you believe. And I have no interest whatsoever in whether you one day feel that you reached the wrong conclusion or whether you go on thinking that you have reached the right conclusion. I really don't. Same goes for what you may or may not have "missed".

Originally posted by twhitehead
I am not sure I am 'anti-spiritual' but I am atheist. You are not only mistaken about the atheist position (which is strange given your claims about an interest in the truth), but you are also mistaken that the believer and the atheist are on the same path or that they are attached to each other.
You claim to value the truth. Are you willing to have an ...[text shortened]... on is free to believe what they believe and I must RESPECT that.
Respect in what way? Why?[/b]

On two points - first, I'm completely on board with your understanding of yourself as atheist; however, my experience with atheists is an outright refusal of any kind of "higher power"...meaning (to me) that the notion of "I don't know" never seems to enter the picture. Just as there are many different religions and pictures that one adopts regarding any kind of religion, so must there be with atheism. If my general characterization of atheism does not represent you, then given this logic that shouldn't be a surprise...there are many other atheistic positions that are far less dynamic than yours.

On the question of respect: There must be views that are completely antithetical to yours, as well as views antithetical to me. I am not going to speak for you; I will speak for myself. I think there are views out there where I wonder "WTF??" and they make no sense. What I have to do in those cases is step back from my immediate reaction and recognize that said person is entitled to that view, and if that's the case, then what can I gain from it? The answer is that I still may gain nothing, but if I soften that reaction (i.e., give "respect" to the position), then perhaps I may understand the position, even while not agreeing with it.

Originally posted by FMF
What on earth are you on about? Look, I don't believe the same things as you believe. And I have no interest whatsoever in whether you one day feel that you reached the wrong conclusion or whether you go on thinking that you have reached the right conclusion. I really don't. Same goes for what you may or may not have "missed".

So if you view your beliefs to be true, you have no interest in sharing that truth with other people? Or aren't your beliefs true?

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
[b]So if you view your beliefs to be true, you have no interest in sharing that truth with other people?/b]

I have shared them. I have been sharing them for nearly 10 years here. I am not asking or expecting anyone to adopt them as their own.

Originally posted by Fetchmyjunk
Or aren't your beliefs true?

This is yet another of your taking-the-piss/self-parody questions.