Star of Bethlehem ??

Originally posted by galveston75
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As intelligent and credible as always.

Originally posted by galveston75
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Btw, it's good to know you know. Know what I mean.

What Kind of Star Led the “Wise Men” to Jesus?

Popular Christmas stories portray the star as a good sign from heaven. Was it really?

The peculiar nature of the star caught the eye of “wise men” from the East, eventually leading them to young Jesus, relates the Bible writer Matthew. (Matthew 2:1-12, King James Version) Popular Christmas stories portray the star as a good sign from heaven. One reference work refers to the star as part of a “divine pre-arrangement whereby . . . the child Jesus was honored and acknowledged by the Father as his beloved Son.” Even Christmas carols honor that star.

What was this star?

Some have suggested that it was a natural celestial phenomenon. A number of scholars have proposed that it was a conjunction of planets. However, as The New Bible Dictionary points out, “such a phenomenon could not naturally be referred to as ‘a star.’” Multiple planets passing close to each other would still appear as individual points of light and not as a single star. Some have suggested other celestial phenomena, such as a comet or a supernova. However, none of these phenomena could maneuver through the sky in a way that would lead the men to a specific city and then stop over a specific house.

Could the star have been a natural event or could it have appeared by divine providence?

Consider some facts: The “wise men” were not what we would today call academics; neither were they kings. They were, as most modern English translations read, “astrologers.” They engaged in a practice condemned in the Holy Scriptures. (Deuteronomy 18:10-12)
Note that only these astrologers were reported to have “seen” the star. If the star had been an actual star, it would have been as visible as a beacon to the public in general. But even King Herod had to ask them about the details of its appearance. This star guided the astrologers first to Jerusalem, to Herod, a mortal enemy of the future Messiah. He intended to kill the child Jesus. Then the star shifted direction and led the astrologers south to Bethlehem where Jesus was, thus placing Jesus’ life in danger.
These facts give evidence that the star was from an evil source, most likely Satan the Devil. The Bible describes him as using “lying signs and portents.” (2 Thessalonians 2:9) It should thus not surprise true Christians that Satan could make only astrologers see a starlike object and could jockey that “star” to lead them to God’s Son, whom he wanted to destroy. Of course, no one can outmaneuver Jehovah God. Thus, it comes as no surprise that the Devil’s ploy to bring an early death to Jesus was thwarted.
It is noteworthy, however, that God did in fact announce Jesus’ birth through miraculous means. On the very night of Jesus’ birth, an angel appeared to a group of shepherds and announced the birth of a “Savior.” The angel also provided directions so that the shepherds could visit Jesus. Then a multitude of angels appeared and proceeded to praise God. (Luke 2:8-14) God used these angels and not the star to inform people of Jesus’ birth. 09' Awake.

Perhaps one should remember this star and what it truely was the next time it is attatched to the top of their next christmas tree?

Originally posted by galveston75
What Kind of Star Led the “Wise Men” to Jesus?

Popular Christmas stories portray the star as a good sign from heaven. Was it really?

The peculiar nature of the star caught the eye of “wise men” from the East, eventually leading them to young Jesus, relates the Bible writer Matthew. (Matthew 2:1-12, King James Version) Popular Christmas stories po ...[text shortened]... ar and what it truely was the next time it is attatched to the top of their next christmas tree?

1) They worshiped the child (Jesus)

2) They brought gifts to honour him and left them with him

3) They were warned off of returning via Herod by divine intervention. They obeyed this warning.

These are the facts are they are irrefutable (Kevin Bacon).

Consider Luke 9:49

49“Master,” said John, “we saw someone driving out demons in your name and we tried to stop him, because he is not one of us.”

50“Do not stop him,” Jesus said, “for whoever is not against you is for you.”

Those who are his are not marked by denomination, cult or creed, but by a willingness to follow in spirit. This is the true church.

Dude you need to put down the JW-Crack pipe LOL

The Visit of the Magi

2 Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, magi from the east arrived in Jerusalem, saying, 2 “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east and have come to worship Him.” 3 When Herod the king heard this, he was troubled, and all Jerusalem with him. 4 Gathering together all the chief priests and scribes of the people, he inquired of them where the Messiah was to be born. 5 They said to him, “In Bethlehem of Judea; for this is what has been written by the prophet:

6 ‘And you, Bethlehem, land of Judah,
Are by no means least among the leaders of Judah;
For out of you shall come forth a Ruler
Who will shepherd My people Israel.

Micah 5:2 states where the Messiah was to be born if Herod knew the scriptures better he would of known also but he had to ask the scribes of the day. God had already revealed it but that does not mean everyone knew. The Magi knew why they had come and if they were looking for the King of the Jews where do you think they would start looking? Duhhhh the capital Jerusalem. The bible never condemns the Magi and at the birth which took place before the Magi arrived obviously Angels announced to Shepherds in the fields what just transpired so I'm don't think God was trying to hide anything at all.

Manny

let the scriptures speak for themselves

Originally posted by divegeester
What utter nonsense, good grief Galveston, read the biblical accounts.

They "worshipped the young child". Has this been removed from your translation? I bet it has as it people worshipping Jesus.

They brought and left expensive gifts

They were divinely warned not to return to Herod and so went home by another route.

These the the stated facts of the account Galveston. Nowhere does the scripture indicate what you are suggesting.

Good point the Magi were warned by God and well they listened .... they went home by a different route


Manny

Originally posted by galveston75
What Kind of Star Led the “Wise Men” to Jesus?

Popular Christmas stories portray the star as a good sign from heaven. Was it really?

The peculiar nature of the star caught the eye of “wise men” from the East, eventually leading them to young Jesus, relates the Bible writer Matthew. (Matthew 2:1-12, King James Version) Popular Christmas stories po ...[text shortened]... ar and what it truely was the next time it is attatched to the top of their next christmas tree?

In that day men did not know the difference between stars and planets other than they knew that some behaved differently (The planets)the ancients called them wandering stars actually because they did not stay in the constellations but drifted around but that is all they could of known at that time in history.

Manny

Your Right the Magi were probably astrologers from Babylon and yes God condemned this practice in the old testament well at least for the Israelites for sure. The question is where did they learn or even know what this "STAR" meant? How did they know it was a very specific sign? They entered Jerusalem asking where is the one that was born king of the Jews ? I think the theory that these Magi were leftovers from when the Jews were in captivity in Babylon because Daniel and his contemporaries taught the Babylonians about their God (The God of Israel) and Nebuchadnezzar even made a proclamation after the Fiery furnace deal that all were to worship the God of Daniel and his contemporaries from that point forward.

Numbers 24
“The oracle of Balaam the son of Beor,
And the oracle of the man whose eye is opened,
16 The oracle of him who hears the words of God,
And knows the knowledge of the Most High,
Who sees the vision of the Almighty,
Falling down, yet having his eyes uncovered.
17 “I see him, but not now;
I behold him, but not near;
A star shall come forth from Jacob,
A scepter shall rise from Israel,
And shall crush through the forehead of Moab,
And tear down all the sons of Sheth.
18 “Edom shall be a possession,
Seir, its enemies, also will be a possession,
While Israel performs valiantly.
19 “One from Jacob shall have dominion,
And will destroy the remnant from the city.”

And
Micah 5:2

With a rod they will smite the judge of Israel on the cheek.
2 “But as for you, Bethlehem Ephrathah,
Too little to be among the clans of Judah,
From you One will go forth for Me to be ruler in Israel.
His goings forth are from long ago,
From the days of eternity.”
3 Therefore He will give them up until the time
When she who is in labor has borne a child.
Then the remainder of His brethren

These Astrologers knew and God can use anyone or people as you see in Numbers 24 He uses Balaam who was not a good man

Manny

Micah 5:2 is referring to the Messiah (Jesus) and well how can His Goings be from the days of eternity ? (eternity means forever) If He was a created being as the JW's state ? Just thought I would ask that question

One will go forth for Me to be ruler in Israel.
His goings forth are from long ago,
From the days of eternity.”

Manny

http://www.gty.org/resources/bible-qna/BQ122011/who-were-the-magi


Good read on who the Magi probably were

Manny

Originally posted by menace71
In that day men did not know the difference between stars and planets other than they knew that some behaved differently
Manny

One would have thought that that god would have known differently.

It seems that throughout the bible god's knowledge is only
equal to Man's knowledge at the time. Curious don't you think?

Originally posted by wolfgang59
One would have thought that that god would have known differently.

It seems that throughout the bible god's knowledge is only
equal to Man's knowledge at the time. Curious don't you think?

This is why we need teh scienz to help us understand god.

Originally posted by wolfgang59
One would have thought that that god would have known differently.

It seems that throughout the bible god's knowledge is only
equal to Man's knowledge at the time. Curious don't you think?

Well the English translations call it a star or sign but this has no bearing on if God knew what it was or not but of course God knew what it was.


Manny

Originally posted by menace71
Dude you need to put down the JW-Crack pipe LOL

The Visit of the Magi

2 Now after Jesus was born in Bethlehem of Judea in the days of Herod the king, magi from the east arrived in Jerusalem, saying, 2 “Where is He who has been born King of the Jews? For we saw His star in the east and have come to worship Him.” 3 When Herod the king heard this, he w ...[text shortened]... ink God was trying to hide anything at all.

Manny

let the scriptures speak for themselves

So...what exactly are you trying to say? If your agreeing with geester dude that's fine but he says I said something to the affect that the maggi were trying to kill Jesus or be a part of his death?
I never said that if you'd read my postings.

Originally posted by galveston75
So...what exactly are you trying to say? If your agreeing with geester dude that's fine but he says I said something to the affect that the maggi were trying to kill Jesus or be a part of his death?
I never said that if you'd read my postings.

I think the essence of what myself and Menace are disagreeing with you on is that you believe the wise men were led by satan through the forbidden act of astrology and we believe they were led by God through signs in the heavens.